Ellis explains SheBelieves Cup roster changes

Allison Lee February 24, 2017 460
Jill Ellis has officially named her 23-player SheBelieves Cup roster. (Copyright Patricia Giobetti for The Equalizer)

Jill Ellis has officially named her 23-player SheBelieves Cup roster. (Copyright Patricia Giobetti for The Equalizer)

On Friday afternoon, Jill Ellis released the United States women’s national team’s updated 23-player roster for the SheBelieves Cup. Originally Ellis called 25 players into the USWNT, which kicked off on February 20 in Orlando, with the intention of cutting two players before the tournament begins next week.

However, Ellis has cut not two players but three–Sarah Killion, Meghan Klingenberg and Amy Rodriguez–from the roster, while naming Jessica McDonald to the tournament roster. She has also named 16-year-old Brianna Pinto to the roster in another attempt to infuse the team with young talent.

According to Ellis, neither Klinbenberg nor Rodriguez are back up to complete match fitness after spending time away from the team because of injury and pregnancy respectively.

“For Meghan, the message was ‘you’re not quite ready’. She’s been battling an injury, she’s been out from all physical activity for a long time and I certainly wanted to bring her in and have a look at her and see where she’s at, but Meghan and I both understand that right now she’s not ready to jump into that intense 90-minute environment. She’s working her way back and the Thorns will be a great platform where she can build herself back up,” Ellis said in an interview published by U.S. Soccer.

“With Amy, again, making sure we give these players an evaluation is important. I think A-Rod in truth, is further ahead of where I thought she’d be after a year off. Not only is Amy playing her way back, but she is also processing a lot of new information from the end of the World Cup until now. The messaging was similar, keep progressing and return to your club environment and be ready to get after it in your pre-season.”

{MORE: Friday Roundup: U.S. U-23 La Manga roster announced | Dash sign Claire Falknor}

Sarah Killion is the only uncapped player to be cut. Killion was first called into the national team by Tom Sermanni for the 2014 Algarve Cup but never saw the field. In January, Ellis invited her into training camp a day after the camp roster was announced. When Killion was called back up for the SheBelieves training camp, it appeared she may have secured her spot in the national team player pool. However, Ellis suggested that it was Killion’s speed and pace that prevented her from making the tournament roster.

“What I said to Sarah was that I was specifically looking at players that play her position, and digging a little deeper into that process meant taking another look at her,” Ellis said. “She is definitely someone we will continue to monitor. Sharpening up her speed of play is going to be a focus for her, but for sure, being in this environment has helped her understand the demands and pace of the international level.”

Despite not being called into the tournament camp, McDonald was added to the official tournament roster. Ellis said that was because she wanted to keep camp numbers low while being able to evaluate players like Rodriguez, but the need for another central forward to add depth to the tournament roster resulted in Ellis calling on the reigning NWSL champion-winning forward.

“Jess is 90-minutes fit and she is a player that can give us a spark off the bench. Evaluating where A-Rod was at this point, and with the reality that Alex [Morgan] took a knock in France, it made it important that we have coverage in that central position. We have Lynn [Williams], [Christen] Press and Alex as pure 9s, and we felt that we needed another central player that could provide that for us,” Ellis explained.

The reference to Alex Morgan suffering from a “knock” might be alarming to some fans, especially in light of Morgan missing Olympique Lyonnais’ last two matches. However, Morgan missed those matches due to illness, while the knock is said to be a minor ankle injury likely sustained during training. Neither she nor Crystal Dunn has been in camp with the USWNT as of yet, but both will join the team this weekend.

{RELATED: All four SheBelieves Cup rosters announced}

Pinto’s inclusion on the roster means the teenager could receive her first cap with the senior national team against a top 5 opponent. The midfielder recently played with the U-17 women’s national team in the Women’s World Cup and despite the team’s early exit from that tournament, Pinto’s play was enough to earn her a call-up to the senior team in January and again for the pre-SheBelieves camp in Orlando. Because of her improvements during both camps, Andi Sullivan being unavailable after tearing her ACL during the NCAA tournament and Ellis’ continued dedication to playing Allie Long on the back line, Pinto was named to the roster to play in the true 6 position.

“What I see in her is someone that already from a January Camp until now is getting more comfortable, is answering questions in meetings and asking questions on the field. She’s someone that is fully engaged, and in the match against the boys, she showed she is a player who wants the ball, and those are some special qualities. Giving her the exposure and experience of being in SheBelieves, which is a big tournament, is a massive investment.”

The SheBelieves Cup begins on Wednesday, March 1 at Talen Energy Stadium in Chester, Penn. where England takes on France before the U.S. faces Germany. The tournament then moves to Red Bull Arena in Harrison, N.J. on Saturday, March 4 with France and Germany playing before the U.S. and England compete. The tournament concludes on Tuesday, March 7 at RFK Stadium in Washington, D.C., where Germany takes on England and the U.S. facing France.

UNITED STATES ROSTER BY POSITION

Goalkeepers (3): Jane Campbell (Houston Dash), Ashlyn Harris (Orlando Pride), Alyssa Naeher (Chicago Red Stars)

Defenders (7): Julie Johnston (Chicago Red Stars), Ali Krieger (Orlando Pride), Kelley O’Hara (Sky Blue FC), Becky Sauerbrunn (FC Kansas City), Casey Short (Chicago Red Stars), Emily Sonnett (Portland Thorns FC)

Midfielders (9): Morgan Brian (Houston Dash), Tobin Heath (Portland Thorns FC), Lindsey Horan (Portland Thorns FC), Rose Lavelle (Boston Breakers), Carli Lloyd (Houston Dash), Allie Long (Portland Thorns FC), Samantha Mewis (NC Courage), Brianna Pinto (CASL)

Forwards (6): Crystal Dunn (Chelsea Ladies FC), Jessica McDonald (North Carolina Coursge), Alex Morgan (Olympique Lyonnais), Christen Press (Chicago Red Stars), Mallory Pugh (UCLA), Lynn Williams (NC Courage)

  • Jlc25

    Are all games going to be televised, even non-USWNT?

    • bfredrix

      Article on ussoccer.com indicates US games will be televised – Germany on FS1, England on FOX and France back on FS1. The non-USWNT games are not on TV but at least this year they will be available to watch on FOX Sports GO.

      • guest

        It’s always fun to watch GER v. FRA.

    • Ron Rocha

      My guess is the non USA games probably on the Fox Sports Go app only.

  • Guest

    Killion not taken because of lack of speed? The other people that play her position are Mewis, Horan, Long and Brian. None of them are exactly speed-ridden either

    • Rdalford

      the actual comment by Ellis was specific to “speed of play” not lack of speed and speed of play is often as much speed of thought as physical speed.

      The EQ article writer is the one who inserted the “her lack of speed and pace prevented Killion from making the tournament roster.” comment
      which does not appear to be fully supported by Ellis quotes

      • By the Shore

        Full quote “…Sharpening up her speed of play is going to be a focus for her, but for sure, being in this environment has helped her understand the demands and pace of the international level.”
        Pace can be interpreted as speed.

        • Ethan

          I’m skeptical of Ellis’ words here, and I’d actually love to see full practice tapes that would justify Pinto getting on the roster over Killion. However, Rdalford is correct. Ellis’ quotes are saying Killion isn’t playing passes quickly enough/isn’t making decisions and reacting quickly enough/being proactive enough. They don’t focus on foot speed at all.

          • tonysocref

            Same here on Ellis’s words. This was an interview conducted by US Soccer. For all we know, US Soccer not only wrote the questions but also wrote the answers with little input from JE.

          • kernel_thai

            Or someone else wrote the questions and the answers and Ellis made her mark at the bottom.

          • NYRick

            Are you referring to the same kind of “practice tapes” that put Boxx on the 2015 WC roster?

          • guest

            the infamous closed-door practices where all the mysteries of the universe are revealed.

          • kernel_thai

            I was hoping to see Killion get a shot at Long’s role not the #6. She is a good passer and has better defensive skills than Long and at 24 is a long term solution to the problem. Even if she can’t handle the speed of play now she could have caddied for Long as she got acclimated.

          • DNG

            It’s potential over current ability. Training and past performance has likely has nothing to do with it. I don’t think Pinto is a better player than Colaprico and Colaprico wasn’t even called into camp.

          • #1Fan

            making decision etc is also a function of getting acclimatized to your teammates. Its not like the players on the team are tiki taka masters.

        • #1Fan

          The old speed of play excuse. I’m so skeptical of the inference that “this level” is so much higher.

      • Arcie Tillydee

        Precisely, and that’s been a key to Allie Long turning into a regular starter: she specifically worked on her speed of play (playing futsal against men, etc.).

        • kernel_thai

          Problem with Long is she wasn’t a good defender at DM (much better at AM) so how can u expect her to defend at CB?

    • sudeep das

      I think Ellis is talking about decision making speed as a deep lying midfielder to start an attack or diffuse pressure by smart passing / distribution. Physical speed is not the criterion here – speed of thought is. Also, understanding of space – how to create and utilize it must be a factor.

      • #1Fan

        Can I ask where she has seen Pinto do this in game ? Does not play the #6.

        • sudeep das

          Has to be in these two recent training camps and the one off match against the boys as per Ellis’ interview.

          • #1Fan

            so as mentioned above, Practice matches and training counts for more than real games including the U-17 WC…ok .

          • sudeep das

            Of course it counts more specially when you are practicing and training within a USWNT 1 vs USWNT 2 environment. Surely any combination of the 25 players invited to previous camps would be much better than any U17 WC team.

          • #1Fan

            I dont agree. You talk about speed of play, I have NEVER seen the USWNT 1 play at the same tempo as JPN U17. I dont think that USWNT 1 would dominate US U17 the same way. Forget the score line.

            By your logic, how does Pinto get to camp in the first place then? Surely NOT dominating U17 competition should mean Not ready?

            Also, given that several members of that team have been selected to u-20 , U-23 and NT – what do you think the level is so much higher?

          • sudeep das

            If you are saying that USWNT 1 or 2 do not play better and faster than Little Nadeshikos then I don’t see any point in this discussion with you.

            My logic of fast mental play was applicable to Pinto being better than other NWSL / college players in the training camps; hence meriting her place in the She Believes squad. How she got invited to the January camp is something I never commented on if you read my posts carefully.
            However she did well in that camp got invited to the next one and did enough to be on the roster. Whether she can hold her own on the international stage is something we will have to wait and see.

          • #1Fan

            Their speed of play is not faster that Japan. it just isn’t. If you think it is, then we dont watch the same sport. I never said they were better. If your point is , lets wait and see how she does, then you are right. There is not point ever discussing the merits of any players selection because we can – just wait and see how the do right?

            There is no way the USWNT 1 would make the US U17 team chase shadows the way Japan did. That game would be a LOT closer than you think. Especially if the U17s were coached by someone good.

            Does fast mental play ONLY apply in training camps? Are you suggesting that the potential – because Ellis says thats why she is selected – is only identifiable in a WNT training camp? Because it sure sounds like it.

          • #1Fan

            US WNT training camps are very competitive. Im sure players thunder in to challenges and battle for everything but I dont buy the speed of play thing at all. If that were true, why do we NOT see that when they play?

          • DNG

            Just guessing here but perhaps some players are better at playing out of pressure in training and that’s how Ellis is evaluating. This would pretty obviously be pretty unfair to any new players though as they have not had any time to get use to the players they are training with or learn their tendencies. Only about 2-3 full NT players can play at the high tempo I think every player on the team should be capable of playing.

          • #1Fan

            I think you are right. Players are laregely being judged on that one variable. However to suggest that the entire team plays with tempo is just incorrect. As you say, they don’t.

          • mockmook

            There are glimpses (that sometimes last up to a whole game), where the USWNT plays like a well oiled machine — even against the best teams.

            But, then they seem to un-discover their true ability, and the whole process starts again.

          • rkmid71

            I’ve really only seen one whole game — that 1st Colombia friendly pre OG. You’d have to tell me about a whole game playing like a well oiled machine against a “best team”. Germany semi final in 2015WC is the best example I can think of. But that midfield is gone. And even though we beat Japan 5-2 in final … it was far from a well oiled machine and Japan outplayed USA for long stretches, after 4-0 in the first 15 minutes. Japan outscored the USA 2-1 over the final 75 minutes. JE doesn’t seem to notice or care about the glimpses.

          • HOFCToDi

            Japan did not outplay the USA for long stretches. The USA owned the first half.

            resources.fifa.com/mm/document/tournament/competition/02/66/12/32/eng_52_0705_usa-jpn_halftime.pdf

          • rkmid71

            Owned in terms of score. But even in that first half (which includes those first 15 minutes), Japan had more possession, more “playing time” 3 SOG vs. 5 SOG (4 converted!) for USA. I was talking about the final 75 which is a pretty long stretch. My recollection was that Japan owned a good chunk of 2nd half. Especially the beginning part.

          • HOFCToDi

            What a bunch of baloney.

            2015 FIFA Women’s World Cup
            Final – First Half

            Shots Attempted
            USA 9 JPN 3

            Shots on Goal
            USA 5 JPN 3

            Corner Kicks
            USA 3 JPN 0

            The USA did not even concede one corner kick in the first half.

          • HOFCToDi
          • rkmid71

            That’s why it drives me crazy that the U17s and U20s sat back and conceded possession to Japan, North Korea. Or maybe they did try and just weren’t good at it, weren’t fit enough and tired out. And even USWNT often does the same against possession teams. I guess I wouldn’t be that confident if I had Long in a 3 back either. Why couldn’t they do what PSG did to Barca? Press high and win possession in attacking third. Teams will probably try to press us in SBC, like England did last year. But we should be able to burn them with our speed up top. No team should be able to press the USWNT. We should be pressing any possession team like Japan …force the action especially until we have a lead and control of a match.

          • HOFCToDi

            Ball possession without shot generation is meaningless.

            As for the youth programs, ask yourself the following questions:
            How many youth coaches have played at least 4 years pro soccer?
            How many youth coaches have obtained a “B” coaching license?
            How many youth coaches have the combination of the two?

            The High Cost of American Coaching

            http://www.topdrawersoccer.com/the91stminute/2016/07/the-high-cost-of-american-coaching/

            A classic case of the blind leading the blind.

          • rkmid71

            I learned in the article that there is only 1 A licensed coach for every 6,000 players in the US. And the A licensed are split between pros and youth. There are only a total of 2,500 A licensed coaches in the US. About triple in Germany, 7x more in Spain.

            Before heading off the college in fall 2016, my kid’s non ECNL team had the same two coaches from U9 to U18. I guess there are pros and cons of that, and most clubs don’t allow that. They force coaching change every couple years. Instead, we changed clubs multiple times, but team incl. coaches stayed together. One was A licensed. I knew the coaches were good as you could see the difference on the field and in the ball skills and IQ and organization, but I had no idea it was so rare as I was mostly clueless in the early years. There was some turnover in players, but the core never changed. Nearly every starter and some subs were recruited D1 soccer and rest at other levels. Many/most were impact players for their team as college freshman.

            The point of all that is to agree that good youth coaching makes a huge difference. YNT coaches really can’t do much to move the needle given the limited time. It has to be the club coaches from the earliest ages and it seems one really has to be quite lucky.

          • HOFCToDi

            As far as I am concerned, the theoretical without the practical is useless. Sure there are always exceptions to the rule but those are few and far between.

            It starts at the grass roots level, 6 year olds without proper guidance is a waste of time and money.

  • Ethan

    So, Ellis didn’t address the defensive responsibilities of the number 6 position and Killion’s and Pinto’s defensive capabilities?

    In my opinion, Ellis’ quotes on Pinto don’t explicitly say that Pinto earned her spot on the roster purely based on merit. They seem to imply that a factor in putting her on the roster was giving her exposure to the environment in the SheBelieves Cup as early preparation for international games in the future.

    • mockmook

      “I guess Killion, like Ohai, really didn’t perform well enough in training.”

      Killion probably didn’t score enough goals in training…

      • kernel_thai

        “Speed of play” is the excuse u always use on this level when u don’t take someone new. Ellis used it last year for Colaprico and Lavelle. It’s right up there with u don’t see how well they do in practice. I don’t get to see practice so this is what I go by. Ive seen Killion play in the U20 WC and Pinto play in the U17 WC. Killion did a much better job holding her own against quality internationals her own age in a high pressure tournament. That seems to be worth nothing to Ellis.

    • kernel_thai

      For me this goes back to earning ur promotion as opposed to getting it based on practice. I didn’t see anything out of Pinto at U17 WC that screamed full team. Im thinking French didn’t either or Pinto would have been bumped to the 20s for their WC. This is just about pretending that development is working. The victim here is Pinto who could end up suffering for this down the road. Make them earn it and u’ll have a team of players who fought to get there.

      • #1Fan

        Or once anointed she will be given unlimited rope. I have raised the issues you and guest have numerous times. Pinto has ability but did nothing out of the ordinary to merit the 23 callup. Being a good practice player seems to count for everything. I’m amazed it takes so little evidence to overrid actual in game performance. That Ellis is capable of finding full team potential in a player whilst her youth coaches select the same over exposed rosters suggests a real issue. It not just potential but the ability to switch position a the full level with no prior exposure.

        Truly amazing.

    • guest

      Pinto played the 8 in the U17 WC not the 6. The 6 was an even worse Howell who was absolutely a complete black hole on the rare times she was even on the ball. She was behind the play all day long. Same issue as Ogle. Both were too slow in every way and I personally believe showed too low a ceiling to contribute to the full team. But they both have not only been re-upped without question, but have been advanced age levels.
      By all accounts, and by any reasonably savvy observer, the u17 midfield and backs were the problem. They were not comfortable enough on the ball to handle the pressure exerted on them by the physical Ghana players and the organized Japanese. Out of those players Most if not all are being advanced beyond their own age groups. This is seriously crazy. What happens when they get to college and are out shined by previously dismissed players? Jordan to Scotland repeated many times over?

      • #1Fan

        Preach.

      • mockmook

        I don’t buy it.

        I accept that the USA players may be lagging other top Y teams in technical ability. But, the “panic” by the MF players (and then just knocking the ball up field) appeared to be the strategy.

        Until I see a Y team TRY to play possession soccer and fail, I’m sticking to my belief that this was at least 80% due to bad coaching/strategy.

        • rkmid71

          I don’t buy that it was the intended strategy. It might have become the fallback strategy once it became obvious the mids and backs Snow had selected were woefully inadequate for the likes of Ghana and Japan. Remember how dominant they were touted to be in all the pre tournament friendlies?

          • mockmook

            Yes, but again, they never seemed to TRY to play out of pressure, so I don’t think they failed at playing out of pressure.

          • rkmid71

            Maybe after they were shell shocked by Ghana, they just sat in trying to get a tie or some result against Japan to advance. What a heck of way to play a WC.

          • kernel_thai

            It’s chicken/egg. U could be completely right that it was a bad coaches decision or Snow could simply know they can’t play out of pressure from practice and went with something he thought they could do.

          • Guest

            They played a different game playing out of pressure when it wasn’t as intense against lesser teams. That is telling. They resorted to boot ball as their tactic to deal with pressure when they faced teams that pressured them more effectively. Pressured either through athleticism- Ghana or superior organization-Japan. Those games revealed the USA technical weaknesses- poor first touches pounced on or lack of tools to gain space to make the next pass. And it revealed the tactical flaws- poor movement off the ball to create timely options for others and poor vision to identify a quick pass to open up the field on the occasion that it was there. Much of the possession was back and forth in the back until pressured and the boot it out. That was common amongst both the 17s and 20s.

          • Frank S

            It totally was the intended strategy. BJ essentially admitted possession was not a priority and that they would get out-possessed by most opponents. It was all clear it out and attack long to the warrior girls up top. He had two years to select and develop, so these girls were EXACTLY what he wanted for his intended style of play.

          • rkmid71

            Can you please remind me or explain why Snow is now Head of Talent ID? Did he have control over the select part of the equation?

          • Frank S

            Yes, he did, for two full cycles. He weeded out any girls who could combine in the midfield, and/or forced them into a rigid pattern-play structure that largely by-passed the midfield and pushed the ball forward. So I have the same question – why is this guy now in charge of college level talent ID?

      • Syd

        True. Pinto never played the 6. Always in an attacking role, yet no goals… Ellis has no idea what a true 6 is, nor how to use one. The Pinto inclusion is marketing pure and simple. Allows the narrative on how great our youth development program is so she can keep her cronies employed.

    • guest

      this is just more jill ellis fake news.

    • tonysocref

      It’s not the availability of pure 6s. It’s
      1) JE doesn’t know what a pure 6 is.
      2) JE wants all of her midfielders to be attack minded. Screw being defensive.
      This is what is going to hurt them in a 3 back system be it a 3-5-2 or 3-4-3.
      Square peg – round hole mentality.

      • Frozen Blue

        We need a Kante, a hard work 6 who makes everyone around him look better. He is why Chelsea is thriving with a 3 back. We shouldn’t even be attempting to play a 3 back in my opinion until we have an established #6.

        • tonysocref

          Sticking with WoSo, I would go with someone in the mold of Amadine Henry.

    • kernel_thai

      Assuming the 3-4-3 until they get blown out and Ellis is forced to make decision, what position did Pinto earn. She doesn’t seem to be a wide midfielder and she isn’t playing the #10. There is no box to box role in this formation. Does Ellis think she can handle world class attackers in the 6 spot?

  • wosofan

    Killion > Pinto Bean

  • Confused

    Morgan missing two games really due to illness or that is just a cover story?

    • guest

      ankle injury too apparently.

      Christen Press fans are about to get their wish of seeing her start at fwd against a decent team… probably. Expect long essays by Reality and Rick.

      • NYRick

        I’m not holding my breath, and nothing Ellis does surprises me. If Morgan is hurt, they will still put her out there at less than 100%. There is little doubt to that. However, it would be nice to see Press get big minutes at forward in at least 2 of these matches. Seriously, what do they have to lose? It is still an exhibition tournament and the team has far bigger problems in the midfield and certainly the backline than at forward. Press on the pitch at forward is the least of their worries. In fact, it’s an advantage.

    • Frozen Blue

      It seems contradictory to even include Alex Morgan on the roster given the following statement by Ellis;

      “I think the difference this year from perhaps the preceding years is that we’re not using this environment as a place where a player can just come in and work their way back into form and fitness. It’s now about them having to be ready to deliver at least 75 minutes in a SheBelieves game. It’s not ideal to take a player who is not yet “played in” and can potentially only give you 15-20 minutes.”

      • Calci0

        She has still played in a competitive game more recently than a majority of the rest of the team.

        • Frozen Blue

          Agreed but if she can only give 15-20 due to injury regardless of fitness or match readiness doesn’t Ellis’s statement still apply?

      • kernel_thai

        Yes but everything Ellis says is a lie. This isn’t a development roster. This is a WC roster with Pinto thrown in for show. The only two players being developed are Short and Williams.

        • HOFCToDi

          Half of the outfield players (10/20) are under the age of 25.

          Johnston, Julie (DOB 06 April 1992)
          Dunn, Crystal (DOB 03 Jul 1992)
          Mewis, Samantha (DOB 09 Oct 1992)
          Brian, Morgan (DOB 26 Feb 1993)
          Williams, Lynn (DOB 21 May 1993)
          Sonnett, Emily (DOB 25 Nov 1993)
          Horan, Lindsey (DOB 26 May 1994)
          Lavelle, Rose (DOB 14 May 1995)
          Pugh, Mallory (DOB 29 April 1998)
          Pinto, Brianna (DOB 24 May 2000)

        • mockmook

          One could argue that Lavelle, Pugh, Sonnett, Mewis, Horan, JJ, Dunn and Brian are all also still in a state of being molded/developed.

          • kernel_thai

            Well Id love to add Lavelle to my list if Ellis would be kind enough to cap her.

          • LM

            I hope Lavelle gets the opportunity at ACM – she is a modern soccer player — we need a critical mass of more players like her getting call ups to change the USWNT style of play. My cynical side thinks that Ellis felt obligated to call her into camp because she went #1 in the draft. My hopeful side thinks Ellis will also feel obligated to cap her this tournament. Either way I hope Rose is impressing in camp, gets her first cap and makes the most of it!

          • Steglitz49

            ACM or ACL ?

          • mockmook

            You can’t get a critical mass if you put all the technical players at only one position (ACM)

          • Steglitz49

            in a state of grace?

        • rkmid71

          I’ve come across many people like that in my work life. They might actually tell the truth when it’s convenient to do so. It’s hard to tell. Some people actually have an ability to believe what they are saying is truth at the moment they are saying it (which is what makes it convincing) even if they contradict themselves in the next sentence. They are quite confident in their lying. And I’ve learned that some people make up “facts” to suit their purposes. I can’t live like that, some people can. It’s not about being naive.I try to live more by John Wooden type principles and values:

          “There’s as much crookedness as you want to find. There was something Abraham Lincoln said — he’d rather trust and be disappointed than distrust and be miserable all the time. Maybe I trusted too much.”

          • Steglitz49

            Being HC of the USWNT is like managing Barca, Man Utd or Bayern Munich — winning is the only option.

      • SpiritFan80

        I was thinking the same thing. Why bring her over if she’s not recovered enough to sit on the bench for her club? Maybe Lyon is just being overly cautious? I don’t have a problem with Kling and A-Rod being in camp, then getting cut if they are not ready. McDonald should have been in camp from the start though, esp since Dunn and Morgan aren’t joining til this weekend. Ellis talks out of both sides of her mouth.

        Side Note – I’m happy to hear that A-Rod is ahead of where they thought she would be. Can’t wait to see her for FCKC. I don’t know how many more years she’ll play but I’ve really missed watching her.

        • guest

          KC with Arod and Leroux should be a lot of fun to watch.

        • kernel_thai

          “Side Note – I’m happy to hear that A-Rod is ahead of where they thought she would be.”

          Which makes it more ridiculous that they brought her into camp. This is the same hopeful roster selection that got Rapine into the Olympics. Either A-Rod showed she was ready for this in Jan camp or she didn’t. Her spot was better served going to a player who was game fit.

          • mockmook

            Perhaps they saw this as an opportunity to accelerate A-Rods eventual re-integration with the team.

          • #1Fan

            Eventual suggest an inevitability about it that re-enforces the belief that current form will have nothing to do with it …Sigh

          • rkmid71

            Both current form AND the reality of other players competing for that spot. Even if her form was as good as before when she was on the team, it doesn’t mean she’s better than an alternative now.

          • SpiritFan80

            I believe the old CBA had a thing in it where players coming back from maternity leave had to be called in to camps for a certain amount of time, if they were healthy and available. With no new CBA in place yet, I believe they are operating under the old rules. That may explain A-Rod’s appearance in this camp even though they knew she wouldn’t be ready for SBC.

          • rkmid71

            I thought it was 3 months they get paid at previous level and have an opportunity in camps (don’t have to be named to every camp) to demonstrate and compete for a spot. But it certainly doesn’t mean they have to be named to rosters for games. Anything beyond that is optional on part of coaches, USSF or whoever. Some players they seem to be tougher on than others.

      • guest

        hopefully, jill ellis has learned from the megan rapinoe rio olympic disaster.

        • Terry Lash

          That’s a very big expectation. If Ellis had learned from the Rapinoe experience Ellis would have left Morgan in France. Bet the reason she did not relates to not disappointing the fans attending the SBC.

    • guest123

      Nobody knows. She did not suit up for their game today against Montpellier.

      BTW, Pia was at this game.

  • VinyMon Ortiz

    Why was the reason Ohai was excluded?, she was one the top scorer last year, plus she has better skills than some in the US team. What is the criteria to be part of the US team?. Ohai is fast and strong and uses both feet to shoot, as for the european teams are improving fast. This year the SB cup will be a very different from last year.

    • wosofan

      All three games for the US last year were highly competitive, I expect the same this year. I doubt the US gets blown away in any game and I doubt they blow anyone away.

      • sudeep das

        Extremely lucky against France in the 1st half of last year’s SBC as was the case in their Olympics face off. The French have managed to technically wipe out the US midfield in the 1st halves in 2016 matches. I wish Andi Sullivan was fit enough to play this SBC as she could have doubled up with Brian to ensure more possession under relentless French pressure.

        • Lorehead

          And in the 2015 Algarve Cup final, and in the two out of three friendlies before that where France did not have home-field advantage, so lucky five times out of six, I guess.

      • kernel_thai

        Last year they gave up 1 goaL in 3 matches. I doubt they do nearly as well with the current set up. That means to get competitive matches they will have to be able to score crooked numbers against quality teams. Ellis believes she can keep the ball in her offensive end and make lots of chances thru pressure. If she is wrong this could go very badly.

      • Guest

        How do you feel after today’s match against France?

    • Eugene Niemierzycki

      I’ve been wondering the same.

    • Frozen Blue

      I would have picked her over McDonald. We only have 3 wings for 3 tough games that will push those wingers up and down those flanks. Even w/o McDonald we have 2 health #9’s 1 hurt and Lloyd who plays there often and more than enough center midfielders to fill in behind the #9.

    • TsovLoj

      I think maybe Ellis thinks her vision issues will hold her back.

      • guest

        It didn’t seem to hold her back in her golden boot run last year. You don’t seem very bright.

        • TsovLoj

          No, I agree with you dude, I’d want to give Ohai a shot, but I don’t think Ellis shares our view.

          • guest

            Okay, then we can all agree that Ellis is the stupid one. Phew!

          • kernel_thai

            Ellis seems to go out of her way to make it hard for players instead of easy. Maybe that’s a good thing. She gave Ohai 7 minutes on the left and she scored a goal. The next two games she played her exclusive on the right. She did the same thing with Pugh. Pugh showed a lot of success on the left side but Ellis was determined to play her on the right. Now I get Heath is on the left but Ohai was most likely heading for a reserve role anyway. Wouldn’t it have smarter to give Ohai the second half of one of those games on the left in place of Heath than try and force feed her on the right both matches?

          • Frozen Blue

            I’m confused because Ellis stated she liked the chemistry developing between Dunn and Ohai on the right, I really thought that was Ohai’s in, so surprised when she was not selected.

          • kernel_thai

            I think Ohai was always a place holder for Pugh on the right. My question is why r there so few reserve players on the flanks. Her coverage there is basically move the starters around instead of having available bench players. Instead she brought in a lot of central players and outside backs. The 3-4-3 doesn’t use many central player or any OBs.

          • Frozen Blue

            I was confused by that as well, why so many central midfielders, it doesn’t make sense. As for defenders my only guess is she plans to switch her formations depending on opponent and wants the personnel available to do so? But having 3 outside midfielders is plenty I guess.

          • HOFCToDi

            Why so many central midfielders?

            3-5-2 tactical formation or 3-4-1-2 tactical formation.

          • Frozen Blue

            Ok in the 3-5-2; 3 CMs in the 3-4-1-2; 2 CMs considering Lloyd will be the 1 yet we have 6 CMs on the roster not counting
            Lloyd. That allows for a complete change of the CMs each game which seems highly unlikely yet in both of those formations there is at least 2 outside minds on the field with 3 people to cover the position, 4 if you count O’Hara in a position most likely to be subbed due to fatigue.

          • Frozen Blue

            Maybe all the CM’s is for the super secret 3-4-3 with all for midfielders being CM’s in a diamond to clog up the midfield vs France.

          • mockmook

            Well, she also used a 3-5-2 last year, so I don’t know why everyone assumes it is automatically a 3-4-3

            And, again, you may not like the choices (or how they are labeled or categorized) but there are plenty of wide playing choices on the roster.

          • kernel_thai

            Only because she used it last. I guess u could also say she switched because Lloyd wasn’t there. So, checked back to Swiss matches where Lloyd was in, Morgan was out and they played a 3-5-2
            1st match
            ……………..Dunn-Lloyd
            Short………Horan……….Heath

            2nd match
            ………….Lloyd-Williams
            Heath………….Dunn……..O’Hara

            I guess u can put Pugh in instead of Short or O’Hara at wingback. Big thing was Press didn’t start either match. But again if this is what she is thinking why bring in McDonald? She has two forward spots to fill and Lloyd, Dunn, Press, Williams & whatever she gets out of Morgan.

    • Terry Lash

      The specific question is, why was Pinto selected over Ohai? From the outside it seems clear that Ohai would be the preferred option. So, does Ohai have bad training sessions? Are there serious personality conflicts? It’s a puzzlement indeed.

      • anon

        they don’t play the same position. Pinto is a central midfielder. Ohai is a winger. For some reason Jill wanted a CM and a CF, not a wide player (presumably a combo of heath, pugh, ohara and dunn will play there).

        • Terry Lash

          Pugh can play CM, and of course so can Carly. Maybe Ellis is planning some kind of unusual formation. I don’t know but I don’t see that Ohai being a winger is the (full) explanation of why she was excluded.

          • kernel_thai

            The roster she picked looked like she was going back to the 4back but she is denying it.

          • CED

            NO lloyd can’t play CM, that’s why they changed the formation to cater to her. She was stinking up the MF in the run up to Wcup 2015 and stunk it up in the group stage. Ellis stumbled by blind chance into the solution and it still hasn’t masked the fact the MF gets dominated vs half way decent teams.

          • Terry Lash

            I don’t fundamentally disagree with your assessment of Carly’s skill. But I am not sure Ellis shares your point of view. In any event, there is enough flexibility on the team for Ellis to have selected Ohai instead of Pinto.

          • DNG

            I have seen Lloyd play as a CM twice since the end of the World Cup. She has really been playing as a second forward ever since the Germany WC semifinal match. The matches she’s played CM since the end of the world cup were the one against Puerto Rico in qualifiers and she also switched to CM after 60 minutes against Sweden when the US was chasing the game. I don’t think that supports your view that Ellis sees Lloyd as a potential CM. Lloyd’s CM play in the World Cup was very poor. I think she was very fortunate to not to be benched for her display prior to Brian’s insertion.

            I don’t think Pinto deserves a call up based on her U17 WC display. I didn’t think she, or the team, was very good in the tournament.

          • Terry Lash

            OK. I was looking over the roster and picked Pinto as the weakest player who could conceivably be left off. For the SBC it would be fine with me to leave off Carly, but I seriously doubt that is a realistic suggestion. Others who also would like to see Ohai on the SBC should make their own suggestions for a player to be removed from the current roster to make way for her. It’s a zero sum game.

          • DNG

            I think your point here is fair. Personally I would have left Pinto off for Ohai but that’s me.

          • kernel_thai

            Pinto only gets something out of this if she plays and I don’t mean a five minute cameo.

          • Frozen Blue

            I would have left McDonald off, don’t need another center forward. I also don’t think Pinto should have even been considered.

          • DNG

            Carli is not a good CM at all and I don’t really think Pugh is one either. Ohai being a winger in the mold of HAO is the reason I think Eillis made a mistake not selecting her. She’s a good choice to be a WB sub and those payers have to run a ton in games. Leaving Ohai off the roster while claiming to be committed to a back three is pretty mystifying. I wonder if Ellis see’s Pugh as wingback cover too.

        • kernel_thai

          She has her wide players spread way too thin. Can Dunn play there…sure…but u figure she starts at wide Forward. Same with Press. U can’t base ur coverage on moving starter out of their best position to cover. It means ur bringing in a lesser player at Forward so u can cover ur flank.

    • kernel_thai

      U really have to question how Ellis’ mind works. Even if u take Ohai specifically out of the equation u have to wonder about the flank. Why bring in players like Klingenberg and A-Rod if u aren’t 100% sure they er ready to compete? They weren’t and u wasted two spots. Why assume Klingenberg, who has been found lacking for pace at OB has the pace to play outside mid?

      The next question is about the coverage for Morgan. McDonald was added because Morgan has an ankle sprain and has been sick but does that mean u need another central attacker? Wouldn’t they be better moving either Press or Dunn central and adding a wide attacker or flank player? What about just giving the time to Williams? And what if they lose a flank player? Will Press once again be forced wide where she isn’t nearly as effective?

      IMO they would have been much better off with Ohai or another speedy flank player who can defend in the first place. She likely wouldn’t have played much but ud have coverage on both sides in case Pugh or Heath have a problem without losing much. U also get coverage at the outside forward spots which allow u to move Dunn or Press central if Morgan can’t go. Instead we get more Ellis illogic.

      • guest

        It is really stupid. I have a feeling the Ohai situation is personal bias on behalf of Ellis or some kind of personality conflict (Ellis has spoken poorly of Ohai to media before) OR it has something to do with the CBA and call ups per non allocated player. The Mcdonald thing makes no sense though. Presumably neither Ohai nor Mcdonald were in the running for contracts and I’m guessing they have about the same # of call ups. I’m not even the biggest Ohai fan but it seems the need for wing players is greater than fwds.

      • HOFCToDi

        How many more flank (attacking) midfielders do you want?

        Heath
        Pugh
        Dunn
        O’Hara

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NNMmFjbNLM

        • kernel_thai

          In the 3-4-3 she has been using u need 2 wide forwards and 2 wide mids. She has the four u named plus Press. The Math is five players to cover four positions. Especially considering she has three matches to play in 7 days and six subs per match Id like to be able to make more than one sub across four positions.

          • mockmook

            In the 3-4-3 all the FWs can be called “central”

            Even then, you have Press, Williams, Alex, Dunn, and Pugh who can play wide-ish FW.

            And, you have Heath, Short, O’Hara, Dunn, Pugh, and likely even Lavelle who can play wide MF.

            These aren’t ideal choices IMO, but they have the players to make it (sorta) work.

          • kernel_thai

            If Lavelle is quick enough to play on the wing that helps. They like Williams in the #9. She played exclusively there against Romania sandwiched between Press and Dunn. Short isn’t a midfielder. They tried her at wingback against the Swiss and she didn’t look comfortable.

            My complaint is about options. If Morgan can’t start Ellis seems to have only the option to start Williams in the 9 or switch formations. If she had brought in Ohai she had these options. 1. Start Williams in the #9. 2. Start Ohai at left forward and move Press to #9. 3. Start Ohai at right forward and start Dunn at #9. 4. Start Dunn at #9,move Pugh up to right forward and start Ohai at right mid. All of those options and u still have O’Hara there for a later move.

          • mockmook

            If Morgan can’t start, you have (at a minimum) Press, Williams and McDonald that you can play as #9

            Beyond listed Forwards, perhaps Lloyd and Horan, too.

          • #1Fan

            its more accurate to call it 3-4-2-1…the 2 are more inside forwards that wingers…

          • DNG

            Ellis doesn’t really seem to be playing it that way though in terms of personnel. Dunn actually stayed a lot wider than Press did and I don’t think either dropped into the midfield the way I would have expected them to in order to support Sullivan and Brian effectively. I think a stronger midfield gives the USWNT big problems in this setup. I think another midfielder that can dribble and connect(maybe Mewis, Lavelle or Heath) would provide a better balance. This all has to change from the last four friendlies too since Sullivan is out for the year.

          • Steglitz49

            3-5-2 or 4-4-2 or 3-4-3 — it is all semantics and Norwegian to me.

          • HOFCToDi

            I have yet to see a starting lineup for the SheBelieves Cup.

            Furthermore, the USWNT has options with the 3-5-2 or 3-4-1-2 tactical formations.

          • kernel_thai

            Personally I liked them better in the 3-5-2 and Id rather see them switch back to that formation than see her try and populate a 3-4-3 with the players she has selected.

          • HOFCToDi

            Rose Lavelle is “tailor-made” for the “1” in the 3-4-1-2 tactical formation.

          • kernel_thai

            Over Carli Lloyds dead body : )

          • HOFCToDi

            Father Time is undefeated.

            Retirements:
            Hamm – 32
            Foudy – 33
            Akers – 34

            The aforementioned are US Soccer Hall of Fame inductees.

            Lloyd will be 35 years old on July 16, 2017.

          • kernel_thai

            Lloyd welds to much sway on that team to have an uncapped player like Lavelle positioned in the midfield in front of her. Would it be fun to see Lavelle get a shot at this? Absolutely, but Ellis doesn’t have the stones to do it when Lloyd is available.

          • HOFCToDi

            Lloyd abdicated her status with the USWNTPA. Must have been the knife in the back to her best buddy Hope Solo.

          • kernel_thai

            I think it was just politics. I think Lloyd was part of the hard liners who were willing to strike to get what they wanted. When it became clear that the moderate players had the votes, Lloyd didn’t want to waste her time fighting for a position she didn’t fully support. I don’t blame her a bit.

          • HOFCToDi

            The hard liners (Lloyd, Solo, Rapinoe) all have been marginalized by the USSF. Lloyd’s ego, Solo’s mouth, Rapinoe’s knee (the gesture not the surgery) are too much for the USSF to bear at the negotiating table.

          • HOFCToDi

            Carli Lloyd and Hope Solo know all too well about politics. Just ask former head coach Greg Ryan.

          • htm222

            Boxx retired at what, 38? Rampone at 41? Not sure what you are getting at. I’m undecided on Lloyd’s utility at this point but if she is in shape and producing more than her counterparts then age is just a number, as they say.

          • HOFCToDi

            Shannon Boxx (35) and Christie Rampone (37) should have both retired after the 2012 London Olympics. Tom Sermanni allowed the culture of entitlement to fester.

          • htm222

            I thought you were a Lloyd fan? I don’t think either Boxx or Rampone (or Chalupny) should have been on that WC15 roster, so we agree there. I’m definitely in favor of more competition for roster spots, but regardless of age you play the best players you have.

          • HOFCToDi

            Carli Lloyd has cemented her legacy with the USWNT:

            US Soccer Hall of Fame

            Aside from 100 goals scored, what else is Lloyd to achieve?

          • SpiritFan80

            Sermanni was trying to bring in younger players at the end of 2013 and start of 2014. They lost some meaningless games and certain veterans wielded their power and had him fired before he got the chance to really do what Ellis is doing now. I wonder if Sermanni was allowed to go forward with his plans if some of those vets would have been in the WWC squad

          • LM

            I agree – hope Lavelle gets the opportunity as ACM.

          • Steglitz49

            How about the 3-5-2 or 4-4-2?

  • sudeep das

    How good is Brianna Pinto – anybody? Last year’s U17 WC wasn’t a good performance by the US midfield.

    • guest

      The answer is solid player at her age and should be developed within her age group. Elevating any of the u17s with the possible exception of Sanchez, does not make any sense to me. They were not successful as a team or as individuals in Jordan. To lock out so many deserving players from consideration, evaluation, and development in order to keep what appears to be a severely lacking status quo is unsettling.

      • sudeep das

        Pinto’s selection highlights the lack of technical ability (fast thinking and decision making) on part of NWSL/college players. The US youth system already got exposed in the U17 & U20 World Cups last year.
        It says a lot for Pinto to leapfrog Sanchez and impress Ellis and the USWNT coaches.
        Sanchez was almost non-existent against technical teams in the U20 WC in spite of being the only U17 player to make the U20 squad.
        We will have to wait and see if Pinto is ready for the international level – like Mal Pugh was in 2016.

        • #1Fan

          how do you get to that? I dont agree with anything you said. The only way anyone could agree with you would be to accept that Ellis knows what she is doing and selects players purely on merit and current form.

          We know that is not true.

          • sudeep das

            Of course nobody needs to agree with anybody in a forum like this.
            The entire premise of my comment was based on the expert observations of Jill Ellis and the USWNT coaching staff. I would rather trust their judgment than anyone else’s.
            Can you elaborate on your conviction about players being ignored despite having talent and form?

          • #1Fan

            I happen to think that the overall level of WoSo is not as high as it should be, BUT on a relative basis, Pinto is not at a higher level than several College or Pro players. What form does Pinto have ? Her most recent “form” was the U17 WC.

            It is not a relative judgement by Ellis. Whatever she sees, she sees, but you can only see if you are looking and I dont think the current selection processes are looking at anything except how a player performs IN CAMP. You have to get in to camp and that does not seemed to be based purely on current form OR current level of ability. That holds true through the entire NY ladder

            Why would you trust them? On the basis of what? Who has Ellis brought in to the group that would lead you to trust her?

          • LM

            Out of the U17 WWC, Sanchez was the sole outstanding field player for the US. She has the quickness, small space control and soccer IQ. If Ellis feels obligated to choose one u17 player, then it should be Sanchez not Pinto. This next U20 cycle already looks to be a big mess for selection with the roll up primarily of last years u16, u17, and u18. I don’t forsee new players being added to this existing pool over the next year.

            I’m very underwhelmed by these full time YNT coaches. 2 cycles now and the style of play is inferior and/or indeterminate. Bring back the part time coaches like Swanson or another college/academy coach that has a definite and disciplined style. He/she would select and train players that execute it best. But that is assumes the US women full and youth NTs actually share a consistent style of play.

          • #1Fan

            Except Sanchez is deemed very similar to Pugh and the NT is not really looking for that role. YNTs should be huge funnels at the start of every cycle where they bring in kids to eventually whittle them down to the core form which they select WC teams. Currently they are, like the full team, Clubs. Once a member , it is very hard to be displaced no matter what you do in actual games. Camps are like standardized tests. Some excel at that, but they are no indication as to who will do best when it actually fonts.

          • Steglitz49

            If you look at the clubs from which other U17 and U20 players hail, the current results should be no surprise.

          • Ashley G

            Sanchez and soccer IQ? This for the kid who looked more to celebrate converting PK in stoppage (U17 WC v Japan) versus grabbing the ball and getting to the center circle because you’re still down a goal? Typical prima donna player US Soccer creates with all the focus on marketing – more concerned about the photo opp than any true soccer IQ.

          • #1Fan

            Parts of this are not wrong. US have been producing ( and more importantly glorifying) more dribble first than pass first players. I honestly believe its becasue we define technical so narrowly.

            if you watch the Japan U-17 WC team vs US , they dont dribble that much, but the first touch is often spot on.- Cushioned, away from pressure and setting up the next one.

            I can see why you look at Sanchez in that light. She is not my type of player yet either. Bit one dimensional. Im hoping she develops because she does have talent. I feel the same about Pugh.

            thing is if you look at these early exalted players, I think they have a ways to go. I dont think they are helped by all the adulation and plaudits at all. I fear Pinto may be in the same boat

            Too much too soon.

          • guest

            you could add sydney leroux to this list.

          • Steglitz49

            #1Fan blocks those who disagree with him. Caveat emptor and Carpe diem!

  • NYRick

    I’m calling it now…two goals at minimum (I think maybe 3) for CP in SBC tournament. If Ellis gives her the minutes at the 9, this will be her show. I stress that Ellis must give her the minutes (as in 90 in two of the matches). Unfortunately, I think we are going to have backline problems in these games and are going to be hard pressed to win this tournament. I’ll be at the RB arena match and looking forward to it. Starting to have really nice weather here in the area so hopefully it’s a great day.

    Finally, have to get in something on Carli, but it is overstating and obvious, but why do they forever list her as a midfielder on the roster. She doesn’t play the midfield, hasn’t for over 2 years. Just call it what it is and list her as a forward.

    • guest

      oh god. he’s back.

      • guest123

        Hopefully christen press has her restraining order set up for the RB arena.

      • NYRick

        In the famous words of Boy George, I know you missed me blind.

    • Reality

      Hi Rick, welcome back. Even though Morgan seems to be at somewhat less than full strength and even though, as you point out, Lloyd is listed as a midfielder, this state of affairs has been true in the past and has not prevented Ellis from, in effect, playing both Morgan and Lloyd together up front as starters for 90″ in major tournaments. Which is why Press has had comparatively little opportunity to demonstrate her normal excellence against teams such as Germany, France and England. I don’t expect any significant change by Ellis is this arrangement. Press will get some time on the pitch as a sub and probably play wide most of the time in competition with Dunn, Pugh, McDonald and Williams. Only if a game is well in hand late into the second half might might Press have an opportunity to play CF. Given Ellis’s past practice, the only way this will change is through retirement (in Lloyd’s case…unlikely) or injury. Of course, a change in the head coach also might work, but Gulati is not the one to do that. And who is going to remove Gulati?

      Have a great time at the game and don’t expect too much.

      • Guest

        What are you talking about idiot? Christen has been starting. She started last several friendlies. She will start vs Germany. Tobin Heath will be looking for her in the games.

        • Bill

          Fastest way to sit is to allow “relationships” ( a relationship outsiders with almost no information have conjured) to affect who one passes to in a game nullifying the better judgement of passing to others. Its not the coaches who will step on that…its the other players.

          Notice that having good and close working, personal and training relationships with most people on a team seems to be a characteristic of the vast majority of people on the team. As was true of the 1990’s and early 2000 teams who lived and trained together.

          People in a closed community pursuing the extreme edges of what they do tend to do the same

          nor is the lack of passes CP’s issue…its scoring when it matters

          • guest

            Tobin and Christen live and train together in Los Angeles and Portland when they aren’t with their clubs. They are photographed by fans all the time in those plcaes. Tobin definitely looks for her during games – it was evident in the last few friendlies.

          • Bill

            Or as a midfielder who looks to pass first, when Press as a forward is open she gets a pass. The exact same games also shows passes to Dunn, Loyld, O Sullivan, Horan, Williams, Ohai and others. I submit the common denominator is open, field dynamics, open space, angles and teammate.

            Ditto Press’s game time decisions….it goes by best available option…not off field dynamics or lack thereof.

            Hence…good players making good decisions for the right reasons.

            Unless, you think they would subvert what is best for the team for personal reasons?

            You think that little of them? Or any NWSL players?

    • smallchief

      I hope Press succeeds in scoring goals against top-notch teams — but i remain unpersuaded that she’s good in clutch situations.

      One thing that would help would be for Ellis to play her in a central position. She isn’t worth diddley-squat out on the flanks.

    • FawcettFan14

      Lloyd is listed as a midfielder because U.S. Soccer wants to preserve the statistic of her being the “highest scoring midfielder” in USWNT history.

    • kernel_thai

      And here’s the rub. If u were thinking of moving Press to the 9 to replace Morgan, and I would, u wouldn’t have brought in another 9 (McDonald) ud have brought in a wide attacker (Ohai). So she is thinking (i chuckle at the notion of her thinking) …she is thinking Williams at the 9 for Morgan and if she is short on the flank Dunn or Press get pushed wide.

      • Frozen Blue

        My guess is she is going to push that 3 back with Sauerbrunn, Long and Short with JJ Sonnett and Krieger to sub moving O’Hara up as an outside wing (Short might also move up if needed) so in her twisted mind she has plenty of coverage on the wings.

        • kernel_thai

          Agree that O’Hara likely see outside mid time more than time in the 3back. Problem is still Sauerbrunn. If she can play the middle then I say go for it but if u have to play her out wide to make this work and replace her with an attacking mid trying to defend world class forwards, ur expecting a lot. Or, put another way. Sauerbrunn will pass out of the back better than Long will defend in front of goal.

      • DNG

        I think Ellis is planning on playing Press like she did in the Romania friendlies. As one of the wide forwards who stays mostly central. Maybe something like this:

        ———-Press—-Williams—–Pugh———-
        Heath———Brian——-Mewis———Dunn
        ———Brunn—–Long—–Johnston———

        I don’t think it’s going to work out well but we’ll see.

        • Frozen Blue

          I would think she has Pugh and Dunn switched in this scenario.

          • DNG

            You might be right. This is one of those situations I mentioned above where I may have taken too much liberty with some of these decisions based on what I think Ellis will do. So far we haven’t seen both Pugh and Dunn in the same 3-4-3 lineup.

          • kernel_thai

            Yes because Dunn can score goals from wide forward and Pugh can’t.

          • mockmook

            I don’t accept that Pugh can’t. Regardless, Pugh seems to make players around her better (she seems to know where to run and pass to make the offense “flow”), so I’d have no problem with her as a starting wide-ish Forward.

            But, conversely, I’m not convinced that Pugh plays well as a MF wing.

          • #1Fan

            Pugh has been a prolific scorer all her life. I think she will score plenty for the USWNT

          • kernel_thai

            Again, no one is saying Pugh won’t do it. She is still very young. Dunn has done it on this level.

          • htm222

            I agree. She and Dunn have a lot of courage and grit. Press is a better finisher from a variety of angles and distances but I don’t think she could or would have scored that Colombia OG goal Pugh did.

          • kernel_thai

            And Pugh couldn’t score the goal that Dunn did against England in SBC if u gave her 20 tries.

          • htm222

            Agree. Dunn can pull out some spectacular goals.

          • Reality
          • NYRick

            That is a truly sick goal. If it was the NBA, that is what is called #10 getting “posterized.”

          • Reality

            Press can be a magician inside the box. Oh wait, isn’t that what a superior CF is supposed to do?

          • NYRick

            Every time she has a private conversation with Ellis, she should have her cell phone in her hand with this clip on it innocently pointing forward and say, “Oh silly me. How did this get there? Sorry, what we were you saying…”

          • Steglitz49

            Ellis might counter with two clips: one from the Glorious 12th and the other from towards end of September.

            Phrases like hoisted by your own petard, spring to mind.

          • HOFCToDi

            Yet Christen Press completely misses the net on a penalty kick in the quarterfinals of the 2016 Rio Olympics.

          • HOFCToDi

            Nobody cares, dumbass.

          • HOFCToDi

            Nobody cares.

          • #1Fan

            Dangerous game to compare this stuff. Lloyd scores some goals that no one else on the team would. Means nothing

          • htm222

            I disagree. Lloyd is one of our best headers at the moment and that means something. Without her, and if Horan or Mewis aren’t on the pitch, we are lacking in that area. Part of why I would have loved to see Savannah Jordan get a call up! She is great in the air from what I have seen in her highlight reels.

          • Breakers fan

            I’ve wondered if her Scotland contract right now precludes absences. Anybody know? Not that we’ve seen any sign that Ellis would have called her in, but that factor is out there – would she have been allowed to leave for a few weeks? Others have been – Morgan, Dunn, Lloyd, so I assume she would have been too. Much more likely she just got passed over. Also left off the U23 team too, … which is ludicrous, again, unless her Scotland deal got in the way, which it very well may have.
            Speaking of which, I’ve never even heard of 1 forward on that U23 team: Celeste Boureille. Will have to look her up.

          • HOFCToDi

            FIFA Women’s International Match Calendar 2017

            resources.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/administration/02/78/12/40/circularno.1535-2017fifawomensinternationalmatchcalendar_neutral.pdf

          • #1Fan

            Jordan is not in the USWNt plans. Thats pretty clear

          • DNG

            It doesn’t make any sense to me why they wouldn’t call her in.

          • #1Fan

            DNG .. I respect your soccer knowledge but you must know that sense is not high on the USSF agenda .

          • DNG

            Of course not. Too many people with agenda’s to push forward the players that make them look good. Unfortunately Jordan is unlikely to force herself into the equation a la Allie Long while playing in Scotland. I hope she comes back to the NWSL and kills it though.

          • #1Fan

            as do I . I love the game and what I see is a very restrictive and biased selection process. It is there throughout the NT process and its ridiculously unfair. Marginal decisions are not my issue. there are so many outrageously biased ones that its scary.

            i=

          • Breakers fan

            Do you think that’s set in stone pretty much, very little chance of change in the future? If so, it’s what I would call probably the strangest call I’ve ever seen them make on a player.

          • #1Fan

            its by no means the strangest. Its par for the course. Set in stone ? …who knows

          • Breakers fan

            For me it’s the strangest for a young player of such accomplishment at that age. Which exclusion(s) of a young player(s) have been stranger in your eyes?

            If it changes, if she is called in, then it loses its spot at the top for me.

          • #1Fan

            not me. i am close to the youth side of it. There are some scandalous omissions. No one cares.

            My guess is Jordan turned then down once.

          • Breakers fan

            That’s fine and understandable. I was talking only at the full national team and now the U23 level. No way in any universe that all the forwards picked ahead of her in the last year for all the camps for those teams should have been.

          • #1Fan

            My point is you see the tip of the iceberg. It start long before that.

          • Breakers fan

            For Jordan, or for bad omissions in general?

          • #1Fan

            For everyone. Is Jordans case anymore noteworthy because its the full team? I would love someone to ask Ellis why Jordan seems to NOT be on the radar. Instead we have passive reporting that asks no real questions …Why? Because no one cares

          • Breakers fan

            Ok, Just wondered if you maybe knew more about Jordan’s situation than the rest of us. I agree that all scandalous omissions are equally noteworthy. I’m simply familiar with the players at this level, while i am not at the younger levels, at least not nearly as well, so it’s what I personally can address.It’s also an odd cutting-off when she passed through the earlier “hoops” consistently and succeeded quite well all along the way, as far as I know.

          • #1Fan

            which is why I think she declined an invite or may have said something to someone.

          • Breakers fan

            It was said during the tv broadcast of the Florida-Arkansas game that she did decline an invitation to a NT camp. But they did not elaborate beyond that at all. Didn’t say why she declined it. Fans, myself included, assumed that it was due to wanting to be with her Florida team late in the season of her final year, a team for which she had been elected Captain. If that is why she declined I think any coach would greatly respect and honor that decision, would actually like it. I would, if I were in Ellis’s shoes. I would say “Wow. That is one fine person, one dedicated teammate, someone who thinks of others before herself.” And then the next camp after the college season ended I’d extend another invitation, but we’re in speculation land here, even if we are getting it right — as to why she declined.

          • #1Fan

            Playing devils advocate..there is no good reason to turn down a request from the biggest Club in the land.

          • Breakers fan

            That’s one opinion a person can have. Is it one that you personally have? What if she turned it down for the ostensible reason – loyalty and devotion to a team she’s spent 4 years with and for whom she was elected captain? Would that reason then make it acceptable to you (assuming you do think it was wrong of her to turn it down)?

          • DNG

            If she wants to play after college and try to get to the top of the sport and the pay scale, it doesn’t make a lot of sense for her to turn down an opportunity. It would be different if the structure of WoSo in this country was club first and the clubs were the primary source of income for these players.

          • Breakers fan

            The implication in what you wrote is that Jordan should have been at least very wary of the possible consequences of turning it down – that she should have thought that “maybe they won’t like this reason and will take strong negative action because of it. That they will be offended first, that the primary result will be a blow to their ego rather than respect for why I am doing this”. We don’t know if that is what happened but if that is how her decision was accepted by the NT then that’s a federation I may not want to be involved with. Not saying that’s what happened or that’s how either side reacted, but I just don’t think she should have let fear of reprisal guide her decision, as opposed to how she really felt about the matter. Again, I personally would have deeply respected her decision had I been in Ellis’s shoes. It would not have had any effect on how I viewed her going forward. That happened when Hatch ended up playing 1 half – that’s probably best case scenario for what Jordan would have “gotten”. That camp came and went with many more on the horizon. We just don’t have enough facts here.

          • DNG

            It’s not that she should have been wary, it’s that no one shouldn’t take opportunities for granted. When I was younger and worked part time in the summer I didn’t turn down hours when my boss offered them to me. I wanted my boss to know that she could rely on my so I would get called more often. If you turn down a call up it may be a long time before you are called up again and the reasons could be legitimate or not to the coaching staff. What you or I think about that doesn’t really matter much.

          • Breakers fan

            We don’t know if she took it for granted. That’s jumping into her head too much for my liking. If Jordan gave the reason we’re guessing – devotion to her Florida team — then that reason is processed by Ellis and co. That’s unavoidable. They hear the reason and they form an opinion about it. And then they decide how to proceed with Jordan from that point forward. Either turning down the invite — and now they know why she did it – WILL have a negative impact on how they regard her or it will NOT. That is completely within their power to control. They decide. Their decision will be based entirely on their reaction to her reason. If the reason they have not invited her back since that day was because they felt slighted, that her reason was not a good enough or acceptable one then either you think Jordan should have anticipated that possibility to an extent where it should have guided her decision or you think Jordan should have done what she felt was right and had faith that she was dealing with people who would understand and respect her decision. If our speculation is right here then she choose the 2nd course and it’s possible – again, we don’t know – that her “leap of faith” is one that has actually landed in mud, that her reason was not deemed good enough, that they felt slighted and are exacting a punishment upon her for making it, for turning them down. That it’s an absolute thing – you just do not do that. But that’s a point of view they’re deciding to take. It’s not the only possible one. We don’t know what’s going on but this is one possibility.

          • DNG

            If that is Jordan’s reason for declining a call up than she clearly prioritized her college team over the NT call up. That might not be acceptable to the coaching staff and no matter what you or I think about that we can’t do anything about it.

            Unless Jordan does not care whether or not she plays for the NT declining a call up for whatever reason legitimate or no, is essentially telling the people who called her up that she thinks she’s good enough to get a call up in the future. I would consider that as taking the chance for granted. She could not be called up in the future for completely legitimate(or illegitimate) reasons.

            If that turned to be true that US Soccer or the coaching staff was holding a grudge against her I would find that reprehensible. But again I don’t really think there is any good reason to decline a call up to the USWNT. Jordan is of course free to make her own decisions.

          • DNG

            If I was in Jordan’s position I would not decline a call up for any reason other than an emergency. That call up may very well be my only chance to impress the coaching staff.

          • Breakers fan

            She put the present and her feeling of loyalty to her current FLA teammates first and said “the consequences will be what they will be. This is what I feel is the right thing to do right now. If that isn’t accepted, I’ll cross that bridge when i get to it.” I admire the selflessness of her action. I respect how she listened to the voice inside her that said “Don’t desert this team right now. The rest is outside of my control. Jill will hear me out on why I’m doing this and then think whatever she chooses to about it. And then after that she/they will treat me however they choose to. I’m doing what I think is right at this moment.” Her actions were FOR her teammates way, way more than they were against the NT, in my opinion, Who did they play out in Utah after that camp, 3 years before the next World Cup? She took a chance to some extent. I don’t blame her or feel she did the wrong thing. It”s on Ellis and co. how to regard her for what she did, knowing why she did it. I put the onus more on Ellis. Her Florida team needed her more than the NT needed to see her at that precise moment. The next moment would come soon enough after. Unless of course it’s some absolute commandment. Thou shalt not…

          • DNG

            If she wishes to take that road, that’s okay with me. But then she also has to accept what the coaching staff decides to do from then on. You and I can criticize all we want but the truth is that our opinions don’t matter much at all. Ellis and the coaching staff make these final decision.

          • Breakers fan

            Precisely – your first 2 sentences. Then, of course our opinions don’t matter at all. Do you think I feel that they do? I’m just laying out the framework of this situation and then it’s up to each person to form his/her own opinion about it. Only Ellis’s matters here, obviously. I’m glad to hear you think that punishment for loyalty to her college team would be reprehensible.

          • DNG

            Let’s assume for a second that there could be a possibility that Ellis told Jordan up front that this might be the only chance she is going to have to get called in for a while. Time frame unspecified. What would you do in that scenario?

          • Breakers fan

            If it were me, or if I were Jordan?

            If it were me I probably would have gone to the NT camp, but I think I’m more self-centered than Jordan. No way to know if it would have altered Jordan’s view. All we know is what she decided, not if there were any qualifying conditions around it.

          • #1Fan

            i dont care why she turned it down. Loyalty is different things to different people its not my business. I do know that kids turned down the U 20 WC team. not sure there where consequences. Loyalty to country is most important to some.

          • DNG

            All of the Stanford kids and some others right? I’m interested to see if that affects their status in the future. It would be disappointing if it did but I’d hardly be shocked.

          • #1Fan

            yep..some really highly touted kids Cook from Stanford and Racioppi from Duke. Both NE kids. Racioppi is rehabbing an injury now.

            Both big prospects

          • Guest

            Ive heard of Cook. She’s my sisters age who use to play club soccer in the area before she decided to play lacrosse because PDA wants devotion to one sport. She spoke very highly of Cook though. She played with Montana Sutton before she moved to PDA and spoke highly of her as well. I think Sutton plays at UVA now

          • DNG

            I haven’t seen Stanford play but I’ve gotten to see a little of Racioppi’s play for Duke. I think she’s very talented. Can’t wait to see how she develops. What position does Cook play?

          • #1Fan

            CB

          • Breakers fan

            But you have to admit that declining a World Cup invite and one to some momentary friendly out in Utah in November, 32 months out from a World Cup are 2 very different things. At least to me they are.

          • DNG

            I think someone could actually argue the opposite. They had different opportunity costs. The U20 WC required the kids to miss their entire college season while the full NT call up was one or two matches out of the whole year. Not to mention that you are also talking about declining call ups to different teams as well.

          • Breakers fan

            I was talking about #1Fan’s notion of “loyalty to country”, and comparing those who declined the U20 World Cup invite vs. what Jordan did here. Declining to go to a World Cup when invited is the ultimate soccer disloyalty to country. Isn’t it?

            Beyond that I think players know that if you’re within the YNT system historically that has paid off for people in terms of a possible NT call-up down the road – more so than very good college performance. That said, you’re right that some U20 World Cuppers probably knew there was a good chance they might sit on the bench and you’re also right that they would miss many more games total by going. However, they would not lose any college time in the end. They would get that year back next year, so no net loss in college time.

          • DNG

            It depends on who is defining it does it not? Someone, for example, could think disloyalty could apply to both equally or one over the other. My point was that it wouldn’t be a crazy POV to value a full team call up for a friendly over a youth WC. Someone else might seem them both as being equally disloyal.

          • Breakers fan

            I’m getting confused here with all the hypotheticals. I’m only dealing with things that did happen. What Jordan did and also how some U20ers accepted their invitation to represent their country in the World Cup and how a few – not sure who, though I think Davidson of Stanford MAY have been one — declined the invite to play at their schools, and then I tried to measure degrees of “disloyalty to country” in the 2 situations.

            Your hypothetical…I think applied to Pugh and she chose the World Cup. I think that’s a greater show of loyalty to country than choosing the full team Fall schedule or choosing to go to UCLA. What do you think would have shown the most “loyalty to country” for Pugh? Does a Full team friendly scenario trump all Junior versions even in a World Cup situation for the latter?

          • DNG

            I wasn’t discounting your view I was just making the case that someone else could see it completely different. I’m not personally making any judgment on which is more loyal or disloyal. I think that forcing the kids to red shirt was selfish from the federation.

          • Breakers fan

            What I wrote about Pugh is assuming they gave her a choice. I would be shocked if they left it completely up to her. I bet they made it very clear, the USSF, which choice they preferred her to make.

          • Steglitz49

            Not if they require you to Red Shirt.

          • Steglitz49

            Hear hear!

          • #1Fan

            not if loyalty to team is paramount. True loyalty knows no degrees

          • Breakers fan

            Jordan showed a kind of ultimate loyalty to team, in my view. Whether Ellis chose to view it that way is up to her. What’s your view on it?

          • #1Fan

            its speculation . to me she has done enough to deserve a look.. we owe that to our best players.

            by the same token, if she does not want to play , I would understand that as well

          • #1Fan

            i would be looking for reasons to include players , not the opposite

          • Breakers fan

            Agreed. To punish her for “having the gall to turn me down!” — IF that is what’s happening, and it probably isn’t or is way more complicated, would be so insecure and ego-based that it would just be gross.

          • Breakers fan

            There is a small segment who cares but I hear you. In the big picture it’s close to no one. But at this level – national team stuff – it seems that anything even possibly controversial is knowingly and intentionally avoided, so I think that guides the lack of reporting as much as a reporter thinking “no one cares”. You don’t bring up things that may cast a bad light on the NT coaching staff. You don’t question their decisions by and large. You accept them and move on.

          • #1Fan

            I have lost respect for so many of the people involved in the WoSo Youth programs. The reason is that so many Coaches KNOW that the selections are wrong, but they dont say a word. OUR teams should be made up of the best players. To promote your kid simply becasue she is yours OVER other kids that you KNOW are a lot better is to fail.

            Its is a source of pride for ALL of us when our your teams are good. We have sacrificed this for self interest.

            National teams should NEVER be a Club. They should be a privilege that we all respect and reserve for our very best. Its no great mystery to many who those are INCLUDING the coaches

          • Breakers fan

            Great post. I thoroughly agree. It’s very depressing to hear that so many feel or maybe know that it is more a club with memberships than an ongoing meritocracy. I hope that changes someday. How wrong they’re getting it is the question and how knowingly, intentionally due to feeling obligations to certain players, for whatever reasons.

          • HOFCToDi

            Coaches have their pets.

            Jill Ellis – Horan, Long
            Tony Gustavsson – Klingenberg, Press

            Tony Gustavsson lost one of his pets, Engen.

          • James F

            Horan a pet? Are you kidding me? She’s been in Ellis’ dog house ever since breaking the mold and choosing to go straight to PSG out of high school.

          • HOFCToDi

            Why?

            It’s not the first time of a player/coach conflict. Just ask Benny and Jurgen. At least one is back.

            http://www.ussoccer.com/mens-national-team/latest-roster#tab-1

            Remember the good ole days:
            Hope and Greg

          • Breakers fan

            Though possibly accurate that theory is only speculation at this point, people grasping for an explanation as to why Jordan hasn’t gotten the call lately. It could be right but until I see it documented then it’s just fans guessing why it’s happening. The other cases are documented. All we have here is Jordan declining one invitation, but it appears she had quite a legitimate reason to do so and any coaching staff with any amount of reasonableness, one who could and would respect the reason for why she didn’t come. — admittedly I’m assuming it was because she didn’t want to ditch her college team in her senior season as the team’s captain — would re-invite her again quickly, despite that declining of 1 camp invite. It is odd to me largely because she seems like such a good, kind, polite person, about the last person I’d pick for some kind of personality clash. I don’t get it but maybe one day we’ll find out.

          • HOFCToDi

            The 2019 FIFA Women’s World Cup is roughly 27 months away. Two years and three months is an eternity in the world of sports.

          • Breakers fan

            Right – plenty of time to bring her in, but……how is she not even on this U23 roster going to La Manga if she figures even remotely into their plans at this time? Evidence is that she doesn’t, that she’ll have to be a world beater (again) just to get another look, but we’ll see.

          • HOFCToDi

            One can be outspoken and diplomatic – Foudy

            One can be outspoken and bombastic – Wambach

          • Breakers fan

            Are you fitting Jordan into this”outspoken” paradigm? If you are, then for you what adjective accompanies her in that?

            Despite her great successes we don’t know if somehow the coaching staff just doesn’t like her game enough. That the omissions hves zero to do with extra-soccer stuff but only consist of their evaluation of what she bring to the table in terms of soccer playing abilities. That would be the first thing we’d need to know. If we learned there are extra-soccer things going on here then we’d have to learn about them. Is it as simple as “you do *not*, *ever* turn down a NT invite. If you do, even once, for whatever reason, you will be banished until informed otherwise. It’s gonna be a while though, we can tell you that.”

            Is that the case? If not that, then what? We’ll probably not learn the truth about this. I doubt some kind of expose will be done about it. I just hope she gets another chance because she deserves it.

          • HOFCToDi

            Who knows what was said over the phone.

            You can be the best employee in a company, but if you don’t respect management then you have hit the glass ceiling. Interpersonal relationships matter.

          • Breakers fan

            Right. But again – that’s speculation that some disagreement occurred. Though I admit that since then she’s nowhere to be found on any NT. I’m just not going to necessarily assume some big disagreement happened, that extra-soccer things are guiding matters with her. We simply do not know. End of story, for me. I want facts only here, not guesses, even if the path leads you towards certain ones.

          • HOFCToDi

            There is already too much politics generated from an outdated CBA with an outdated player allocation system. More than thirty years after the establishment of the USWNT, yet the USSF still subsidizes a domestic league. Ridiculous!

          • htm222

            Clearly she got Ellis’ attention if she was called into their camp last year and declined. I think she is better than Hatch and Purce out of this year’s draft class. I’d love to see her pair up with Sinc with the Thorns but I guess she is doing her own thing in Scotland for the time being.

          • Breakers fan

            Not sure if she plans to join the Thorns at the end of her Scotland season. I agree that she’s better than those 2, though I think highly of Hatch, so I’m not 100% sure who will have a better pro career and I have not seen Purce nearly enough but I am pretty sure I will regard Jordan more highly.
            She definitely got Ellis’s attention but then how Ellis takes it from there is completely up to Ellis. She could have instantly said “That is a great reason. You’ll be invited back to the next camp. No worries. I respect what you’re doing very much. That’s the kind of teammate I’m looking for, in fact.”

          • guest

            That’s why the McDonald call up drives me batty. She’s a practice player and a temporary patch up for an obvious problem with scoring in recent tournaments. I like Jess in the sense that she is a good soldier and can hit the back of the net, but we all know she isn’t an investment for the future at 29. Maybe she should have gotten a look long before now but that time has passed. Calling in a promising younger player like Jordan or Ohai would have made a lot more sense.

          • Breakers fan

            Well-said. Couldn’t agree more. Juxtapose the Pinto and McDonald selections for a mind-altering dose of cognitive dissonance.

          • DNG

            I think they should be calling up the best players at the moment period. It’s one of the reasons I don’t think Pinto should have been given preferential treatment. Jordan should have been called into January camp but if Mcdonald was deemed to be the better striker right now she should be selected to the roster. Ohai is a different circumstance because she plays a different position. I think she should have been selected though.

          • Breakers fan

            How do you determine who is playing better now between Jordan and McDonald and who makes that call and what do they base it on? Nothing against McDonald but for that position and never having had Jordan in camp I would look more towards the future with that selection. I’d pick Jordan but that’s just my opinion and I agree that a case could be made for McDonald. She has worked for years to get there and 29 is not too old. Who would you have chosen between the two considering the NT – its present and future?

          • DNG

            I think the team should chose the proven NWSL players to be honest. Let the new pros prove in the NWSL or what ever league they are playing in. I would have brought Jordan to camp though and chosen her if she clearly stood out though. Colaprico should have at least been called into January camp. What would honestly be the worst thing for the league in my opinion was if the stars who weren’t allocated decided to play in Europe because they thought they had no chance of making the NT.

          • Breakers fan

            Sounds like you lean towards NWSL players (I do too) but that can be trumped by what you said in your first post “I think they should be calling in the best players at the moment period.” Would you have Pugh in camp? I would. I agree about Colaprico – frustrating that she hasn’t gotten time on the field yet. I don’t watch CRS enough to have a great feel for how good she is but I suspect that she is very good. I do recall her at UVA being a good, reliable player who didn’t commit many turnovers. Not sure what marks they have against her at the national level.

            Yeah, a potential European exodus..I wonder too..don’t really have a sense of how likely that may become. I really wonder what the current incumbents are trying to get into the new CBA about how many “new” players will be allowed to be invited into camps into the future – that will probably have a big effect on people’s actions. If the language improves on that subject NWSL players will still need to see results – new players in decent numbers being called in.

          • DNG

            Pugh is in now but that doesn’t mean we should be extending the same silver spoon treatment to others. If they prove in camp or in their matches that they are special players sure exceptions can be made but players like Pinto are not that and even thought I’m rooting for Jordan to be great I don’t know if she’s that either yet college performance and all.

          • Breakers fan

            I agree that it’s hard to predict with any kind of certainty how good these players will be; and I too wouldn’t have chosen Pinto for this camp – nothing at all against her – she’s just answering a call made to her.

          • Steglitz49

            American players went to Australia and played during the winter break so you could talk of sort-of an Australian Exodus too. The difference is that it is the top notch players and those with promise that are joining European clubs, not the flotsam, jetsam a detritus.

            The chances of being picked for the USWNT are slim. On top of that youth players like Pugh and Pinto get a chance. Any young lady with an ounce of sense would use her soccer skills to experience a different culture or cultures.

          • Steglitz49

            29 today means 31 in 2019, the wrong side of 30.

          • Breakers fan

            Makes you wonder if Jordan is in fact receiving some kind of punishment – assuming the CBA language isn’t the barrier for her here vs McDonald.

          • Steglitz49

            You mean a soccer version of “so as to encourage the others”?

          • Steglitz49

            Calling up Jess today is safe. You can drop her without criticism. She is just a temporary patch. If JE brought in Jordan or Ohai and they played well, she could hardly drop them just like that.

          • guest

            unless you are playing for the USWNT machine and have a contract. it’s pretty hard to get fired. see: chalupny, rampone, boxx, wambach, buehler, rodriguez…

          • HOFCToDi

            Oh really?

            Solo – you’re fired!
            O’Reilly – you’re fired!
            Engen – you’re fired!
            Hinkle – see ya!

          • Steglitz49

            Solo fired herself and may yet be taken back into the fold.

            HAO is not as good as she was and Whitney Engen has had a good innings.

            Hinkle — who was that?

          • DNG

            Boureille plays for Portland and she’s a CM.

          • Breakers fan

            Thanks. I looked her up – went to Cal. I saw Cal just a little, didn’t notice her. Did she play for Portland last year or will she be new to them this coming year? If last year, what did you think of her?

          • DNG

            Only during the break. The Thorns are deep at CM at the moment. She also played for Canberra on loan in the W-League. If there are some games of Canberra online I’d look for them since she started for them I believe.

          • Breakers fan

            Thanks. They list her as a forward for the U23s, but for both Cal and the Thorns she played CM, as you said, so, again, one of those weird, seemingly incorrect position listings.

          • htm222

            It would be incredibly petty if Ellis is blacklisting her because she declined one call up last fall for her college playoffs. Then again, spots on this team under the current CBA are so scarce that there is no margin for error, however subjective it may be.

          • Steglitz49

            FIFA windows apply around the globe. They do not, however, apply below senior NT.

            For example in the U20 WC, Sweden and some other NTs were missing players whom their clubs would not release. Thus, Glasgow could refuse to release her for U23 events.

          • #1Fan

            you disagree on what? It is dangerous to compare how spectacular a player goals are as a method of ranking their effectiveness. in reality great movement and timing leads to tap ins. Its like saying A GK is great because they make spectacular saves. The very best GKs are so good ion positioning that they are rarely called on to perform heroics.

            Its a totally different discussion to say you like having an aerial threat.

          • htm222

            I disagree that a player’s specific talents that lead to unique scoring opportunities “mean nothing”. Lloyd has her faults but her unique talents as well. Press, Pugh, Dunn, and Morgan also have their faults and strengths.

          • #1Fan

            You are totally misunderstanding the comment.

            Comparing who score the more spectacular goal is pointless.

            I did not say HOW players score is pointless.

          • DNG

            What are Lloyd’s unique talents? I don’t really see anything in her game that I haven’t seen before or that I consider unique to WoSo.

          • #1Fan

            Talents leading to opportunities is not the same as saying A is better than B because she scored this spectacular goal that B could never score.

          • DNG

            Why not just play Horan as a forward then if you want someone who can provide an arial threat. She’s better than Lloyd at that and a lot of other elements of the game as well.

          • htm222

            I don’t disagree. I’d like to see Horan play up front, although I’m not sure where she fits in this current formation.

          • DNG

            She can play in the center of the formation and I think she could do it well. She is unlikely to get a chance though since she doesn’t press as well as the others(slower) and doesn’t have the built up “cache” that Lloyd does.

          • kernel_thai

            Well I meant can’t yet. Pugh might develop into a good goal scorer but she hasn’t shown it yet at this level. Pugh is a slick passer and uses space pretty well so Id rather have her on the left flank with Heath on the right. Dunn however had 14 goals last season including some against quality. She gets a lot good chances using her quickness to get in front of goal to cash in second chances.

          • htm222

            I think she is better as a forward than a wingback… she turns the ball over a lot. Defense is not her strong suit.

            my ideal formation if we are insisting on 3-4-3 would probably be something like

            Pugh Press Dunn
            Heath Brian Mewis Ohara
            Short Sauerbrunn Krieger
            Naeher

          • #1Fan

            can i ask what the difference is between a forward and a wing. To me they are both forward positions . In 433,,winger do track the wide attacking option son the other team, but in 3421/343 not so much. I dont see a big defensive role for any of the front 3 other than perhaps pressing

          • htm222

            … which is why I’d like to see pugh in the front. I think she’s better than Morgan at this point in time, especially if Morgan is hurt. Rather see Heath and OHara on the wings

          • #1Fan

            so wing to you is the equiv on my outside mid ..ok got it

          • htm222

            I’ve seen speculation that Pugh is going to be outside midfielder … in a 3 back I don’t see that working because she doesn’t have the defensive ability

          • HOFCToDi

            You mean like tracking back all the way to the end line to cover Lucy Bronze?

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8R8CrNsjWE&t=4736s

            20:00

          • #1Fan

            She is not a great defender but she has speed, stamina and is a hard worker. I could see her using those assets to be ok in that role..BUT i think its a waste, especially coming of a knee injury. Its a high stamina position vs good teams. I dont think 343 suits Pugh at all. Just my opinion.

            My issue with Ellis tactics are that it feels like the formation is an accommodation to get players like Lloyd on the field. i would much prefer a 433 variant with Pugh playing R or L Wing but then its Lloyd at 9 or nowhere.

          • htm222

            I’m still trying to get the soccer nomenclature down, so excuse me if I make a mistake. I’m a life long “net sport” player myself (tennis and volleyball) but love watching women’s soccer.

          • #1Fan

            its not a mistake at all. I just wanted to be speaking the same language 🙂

          • DNG

            I think that the wing in a 4-3-3 and an attacking outside mid in a 4-2-3-1 are very similar positionally. I think that a player’s role probably has more to do with whether I would classify them as an outside mid or a wide forward. Their defensive responsibilities are pretty much exactly the same. I think Pugh would fit in okay in the 3-4-2-1. I don’t think that would be a good formation for the team though.

          • #1Fan

            i am not debating that . Just trying to clarify what role htm222 was referring to within the 343. LM or LW

          • DNG

            Okay I was confused. It seems like htm222 is calling the position Heath has been playing outside mid. I truth Heath has been playing the offensive role of an outside mid with the defensive role of a wingback which is a little unorthodox. I agree with you on Pugh in that position though. She could play there but it would be a waste and she wouldn’t be as good there as Dunn would be.

          • guest

            If Morgan was healthy I’d put her in Pugh’s spot and put Pugh in O’Hara’s spot. Overall I agree though . Long doesn’t beLONG (lolllllllll) in a 3 back.

          • Frozen Blue

            Press would get a lot of service with this formation.

          • HOFCToDi

            http://drawformation.com/post/58b23c3141df4/58b23c3141df4.png

            I can’t wait for Andi Sullivan to recover from ACL surgery and boot Allie Long out of the starting XI.

          • Steglitz49

            She might not

        • wosofan

          You have Mewis starting over Horan? That is interesting.

          • DNG

            In a 2 player midfield yes. Horan can’t cover the space. Maybe I took too much liberty with what Ellis would do and made some decisions for her. Horan still seems to be above Mewis on the depth chart although Ellis has been starting to play Horan further forward in the hole while Mewis has pretty much stayed at CM. I wouldn’t play a 3-4-3 with this lineup personally and I wouldn’t use Long as a CB. I think that’s asking for trouble.

        • guest

          U cray if you think Lloyd isn’t playing somewhere.. probably in Williams’ spot.

        • kernel_thai

          ……….Press……..Williams……..Dunn
          Heath……………………….Lloyd………….Pugh
          ……………………….Brian
          ………..Short………….Long………..Sauerbrunn

          • htm222

            Lloyd is NOT a midfielder anymore. She has been playing forward with one of Press, Dunn or Morgan.

          • kernel_thai

            She’s been playing a false 9.

          • DNG

            Lloyd doesn’t play a false 9 for the USWNT. She can’t play a false 9 when the US are playing one or two true 9s. That completely negates what a false 9 would be aiming to do. She sort of plays a false 9 for Houston but still more of a true 9 there too.

          • kernel_thai

            Well Lloyd has what Ellis calls a free role which means she pretty much does as she likes.

          • NYRick

            Hey kernel, haven’t spoken to you in awhile, congrats on the Sounders. Now there is only one choke team left in the MLS, my NY Red Bulls. They also recently traded the heart and soul of the team, Dax McCarty.

          • kernel_thai

            Thanks

          • NYRick

            Let’s cut to the chase, Lloyd plays whatever and wherever she wants on the pitch for the national team. Her responsibility now is to get to age 41 or so and eclipse Abby’s goal scoring record. It’s happening, don’t laugh.

          • Steglitz49

            Let’s cut to the chase: OG 2008 and 2012 and WC 2015 do not lie.

          • rkmid71

            “Failure is never fatal. But failure to change, can and might be.” OG 2016 was a failure. Today is the only day, yesterday is gone.

          • Steglitz49

            OG-16 differs from WC-07 in that the level of failure was not only worse but also in that there is not a tournament in the immediately following year in which to restore reputation.

            It is hard to conceive of the USWNT getting less attention than Jessica Diggins, Sadie Bjornsen and Kikkan Randall are getting for their successes in the World Championships in X-country skiing but with only friendlies till summer of 2019, why would anyone care about WoSo in the US?

          • kernel_thai

            None of Lloyds three 2015 goals against Japan were the result of her playing CM. She could have gotten all three from the CB position.

          • Kevin

            “None of Lloyds three 2015 goals against Japan were the result of her playing CM. She could have gotten all three from the CB position.”

            None of Lloyd’s 6 goals in the entire WC were the result of her playing CM. 3 were off set-pieces, 2 were PK’s, 1 was a midfield shot.

            • She scored off a PK against Colombia.

            • She scored off a set play against China. Ball was chipped in from about 40 yards out to a large group of players around the penalty spot and Lloyd headed it home.

            • She scored off a PK against Germany.

          • Reality

            Lloyd’s position on the pitch defies classification.

          • #1Fan

            False … yes

          • DNG

            I’m with htm222 if Lloyd has to play she has to play CF.

          • kernel_thai

            If Lloyd is going to play CF and Im not opposed, why bring in McDonald?

          • DNG

            No clue what Ellis has planned you may be right and I think it would be a huge mistake to play Lloyd as a CM. She is incapable of playing the position at a high level.

          • Reality

            Lloyd already plays CF whenever it suits her no matter who was the CF designate in the lineup.

          • kernel_thai

            And this is the paradox. If u pretend to play Lloyd in the midfield then what u actually get is Brian playing the midfield alone. Better to start Lloyd at the #9 with Morgan out so u can have two actual midfielders behind her.

          • Reality

            Uh no. Better to utilize real #9’s who have the skills and experience to fully encompass the position. Lloyd disturbs the run and flow of play. She would be best used from the bench and brought in when her particular talents match the circumstances of the match.

          • NYRick

            Careful, you ARE talking about the 2-time Best Female Footballer on the Planet there. I would weigh my words.

          • Reality

            I use the finest of scales in weighing my words. btw, where have you been? Hope you have refreshed yourself.

          • NYRick

            Yes, thanks. I’ve just been very busy with work and some travel. Took a break from here, not much was happening later part of the year and got bored with the continual linkmaster’s daily Press bash. There are some very intelligent and passionate fans like yourself who make coming here a fun excursion. Actually now looking forward to the season starting up again and the SBC is really the best thing in women’s soccer right now.

          • Reality

            Since you’ll be attending the match with England, I’ll expect a complete report.:)

          • NYRick

            Absolutely. I’ve got pretty good seats. Also, checked and the game is close or is a sellout right now. Good seats on Stubhub are absurdly high priced.

          • Steglitz49

            Report to us from the match, please.

          • NYRick

            BTW, just curious, are we looking at another season of 90 minute Carli listed as a “midfielder” and keeping Press off the pitch for the most part? And can Ellis just play Press at CF all the time when she does play? This isn’t brain surgery.

          • Reality

            As you are well aware, every time in the past when we thought that Ellis would finally give Press a real opportunity at CF in major tournaments, our hopes have come to naught. This SBC will be one more chance for realization…or not.

          • NYRick

            I’m still going with in 2017 what I thought (what we both thought) in 2014 and what my eyes always told me…when healthy my two-forward pairing for the bulk of every NT game has #13 and #23 as my forwards. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

          • kernel_thai

            I still believe that the best lineup has Press behind Morgan. Press can do so many things with the ball and there is just more room to do them in the middle. Yes, I realize Im talking about land set aside in perpetuity for the Lloyd Memorial Trust

          • kernel_thai

            There is a new dynamic now. Rule 1. Heath has to play on the left. Doesn’t matter that other players r much better on the left then right while Heath plays about the same on either side. Rule 2 Press has to play on the left cause Heath is there. This rules out Press playing CF cause too far from Heath. It does mean Press has to start tho cause if Press is on the bench Heath will just hang around the bench area and only play balls near the bench. OK, I just made all this up….kinda.

          • Steglitz49

            Touché!

          • Reality

            You’re beginning to sound like Ellis…or you’re just satirizing the trolls here who like to gossip?:}

          • kernel_thai

            Maybe but Heath passed the ball to Press more last year than in the three previous years she was on the team combined.

          • Steglitz49

            singular or plural?

          • Reality

            Source?

          • HOFCToDi

            Christen Press is an international fraud.

            Summer Olympic Games
            Games Started
            Leroux (DOB 07 May 1990) – 0
            Press (DOB 29 Dec 1988) – 1

            Summer Olympic Games
            Minutes Played
            Leroux (DOB 07 May 1990) – 77
            Press (DOB 29 Dec 1988) – 123

            Summer Olympic Games
            Goals Scored
            Leroux (DOB 07 May 1990) – 1
            Press (DOB 29 Dec 1988) – 0

          • HOFCToDi

            Tournament performances worthy of de-allocation:

            From bad ……………………………………………………………..

            Christen Press
            2015 FIFA Women’s World Cup
            Goals 1, Assists 0, Shots Attempted 7, Shots on Goal 2
            Penalty Kicks Attempted 0, Penalty Kicks Converted 0

            To worse ………………………………………………………………

            Christen Press
            2016 Summer Olympic Games
            Goals 0, Assists 0, Shots Attempted 6, Shots on Goal 1
            Penalty Kicks Attempted 1, Penalty Kicks Converted 0

          • Steglitz49

            Seeing that this is a year of friendlies, who, apart from Press, cares?

            The true WoSo cation is in Europe this year, club as well as NT. That explains why certain players have taken the foreign coin.

          • HOFCToDi

            While the “Press Gang Troll Brigade” continue to fawn over the international fraud Christen Press, an international superstar sets a new NCAA & U.S. Open & American Record:

            swimswam.com/ledecky-scorches-ncaa-american-records-425-15-500-free/

          • HOFCToDi

            While the “Press Gang Troll Brigade” continue to fawn over the international fraud Christen Press, an international superstar sets a new American Record:

            swimswam.com/katie-ledecky-takes-american-record-357-6-400-im/

            Now the 400 IM? She’s crazy!

          • Guest

            Uh, that would be never.

          • kernel_thai

            From the roster she has called here r ur choices against Germany 1. Start Williams at the 9. 2. Start McDonald at the 9. 3. Start Lloyd at the 9 and play either Horan or Brian behind her. If Press or Dunn were an option she wouldn’t have added a CF.

          • Steglitz49

            None of the above?

          • Reality

            According to Ellis, “Jess is 90-minutes fit and she is a player that can give us a spark off the bench.” But who can believe her forecasts.

          • kernel_thai

            She is a pro and NWSL camp is just around the corner so I would expect her to be in pretty good shape. Course it would have helped to have her at the Orlando part of camp.

          • Reality

            I don’t see MacDonald as an option for starting at CF (“…can give us a spark off the bench”) but since Morgan may not be fit for 90″, Ellis will be platooning the forwards in some kind of configuration throughout the 3 games.

      • NYRick

        Still waiting for someone to adequately explain to me that when all healthy, and it’s against Germany/France/England/Sweden…how do you not have Morgan-Press as your two forwards and Pugh and Dunn as your two flanks. Tobin can play central mid with Brian. Move Long up as a destroyer the rest of the back three can be JJ, Brunn, Short etc. Who’s beating that? Oh, I forgot. Carli has to play.

        • Steglitz49

          In the Miracle on Grass aka Bomb in Brasilia, the USWNT was split apart by accurate penetrating passing at speed.

          The defense was not up to the task. A bit like Stalingard, if you prefer.

  • Reality

    OL defeats Montpellier 3-0 with a brace by Renard and one by Bremer. Morgan did not play…still recovering from her “illness”…

    https://twitter.com/KopFenottes69/status/835509933965733890

    • guest1234

      Pia was there too.

      • Reality

        Old school reunion.

        • kernel_thai

          Morgan likely spent the plain ride flipping thru the family tree to see if she has Swedish ancestors.

          • Reality

            Well, figuratively speaking, Sundhage adopted her.

        • guest1234

          Looks like it. Pia in the back of the pic.

          https://mobile.twitter.com/Zac13_/status/835595002625417216

          • Reality

            Reminiscing about the good old days.

        • Steglitz49

          Blackstenius and Sembrant play for Mont pellier and Jakobsson is on their injured list, while Seger plays for Lyon.

    • guest

      Morgan shuttles between Lyon and US camp?? Uncroyable!!

      • Reality

        The new state of affairs.

    • guest1234

      Precheur on why Alex Morgan did not play today for Lyon.

      Morgan remained in the podium, was it a sports choice?

      Alex Morgan is frustrated, unhappy but we agreed to a gradual return. She had a hard time recovering after her stomach, she lost weight. In addition, she had a small sprained ankle where she was already hurting. I did not want to take the risk.

      She’s gonna go to the selection, and we’ll need her because we have to play on all three tables. If she gets better, she will not make more than 20 to 25 minutes with the selection next Wednesday. The goal is that it regains its level.

      http://www.footofeminin.fr/D1F-Gerard-PRECHEUR-Lyon-On-a-besoin-de-ce-type-de-match_a13381.html

      • Reality

        Thanks for the clarification. It must be disappointing for Morgan to have been with Lyon for the past 7 games, didn’t play in three of them, only played 45″ as a sub in 2 others and did play 90″ in her first two games with a grand total of 0 goals and 2 assists. Hopefully we are not getting a snow job about her “sprained” ankle. I think that Ellis’s utilization of her at the SBC will be revealing of the true state of affairs re: her physical condition and overall fitness.

        • Lorehead

          I can only imagine how disappointing for fans of Lyon.

          • Steglitz49

            As long as she is fit for the Champions League matches against Wolfsburg at the end of March, all will be well.

          • Reality

            Not to mention Aulus.

      • guest

        alex morgan went from a 90 minute starter for lyon to a 45 minute second half sub to now a 20 minute second half sub. this is not the kind of treatment the greatest forward in the world should receive. outrageous.

        • sudeep das

          Has she been the greatest forward over the past 12 months? Her consistency has gone down as 2016 progressed – missing chances and most importantly lacking that first touch to control the ball in the box or taking that extra touch when a first time shot would have created havoc. It is more frustrating when you know what she is capable of after watching those goals against France and Germany in the 1st She Believes Cup.
          Overall the entire US forward line is guilty of profligacy specially Morgan and Press. What really is surprising is their unwillingness to take first timers when it is obvious that an extra touch will close the goal mouth.

      • kernel_thai

        So Prechuer has spoken with Ellis and she has agreed to limit Morgan to 20-25 against Germany? Welcome to coaching outside the USWNT bubble, Jill.

  • Lorehead

    Oh, Alex Morgan only has a minor ankle injury? What a relief.

    • guest

      Out of all the players I could see her career getting cut short, possibly before the world cup, by injuries. She always has some issue it seems.

      • guest

        I really thought she was returning to 2012 form early last year. Not so sure anymore

        • Observatio

          Hard to believe Alex was at the top of her game five years ago.

          • Steglitz49

            Injuries take their toll. Carli and Christen have essentially been free of injuries.

          • HOFCToDi

            You don’t have a clue what transpires in the United States, as usual.

            usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/soccer/2010-04-27-299671689_x.htm

            ussoccer.com/stories/2014/03/17/12/46/us-midfielder-carli-lloyd-breaks-bone-in-shoulder

          • Steglitz49

            The Miracle on Grass does not lie.

        • guest

          very unlikely morgan will return to 2012 peak from at this point. not after another five years of age and injuries have added up.

      • HOFCToDi

        Calendar Year 2016
        FIFA Top 12 Ranked Opponents
        USWNT Goals Scored
        Morgan (DOB 02 Jul 1989) – 6
        Lloyd (DOB 16 Jul 1982) – 2
        Horan (DOB 26 May 1994) – 2
        Long (DOB 13 Aug 1987) – 1
        Heath (DOB 29 May 1988) – 1
        Johnston (DOB 06 Apr 1992) – 1
        Dunn (DOB 03 Jul 1992) – 1
        Mewis (DOB 09 Oct 1992) – 1

        By the way, Christen Press is not on the list.

        ussoccer.com/womens-national-team/lineups/2016-lineups

  • CED

    Wow, it’s interesting that being fit is such as priority when it wasn’t when she placed an unfit and useless Rapinoe on OG roster.

    • #1Fan

      reading your points 2 and 3 and relating it to your reply above …maybe they ( including Pinto ) trained better than everyone else.

      • CED

        If Pinto somehow trained and is better in drills, scrimmage, etc…than current USWNT MF, the state of affairs is even worst than my worse nightmare. The only young MF that has showed promise was Sullivan. Hope she recovers well from the ACL injury.

        • #1Fan

          By your logic, she must have no ?

  • guest

    somebody needs to check in on that smallchief guy. he’s probably standing on the edge of the golden gate bridge right now despondent over the exclusion of megan rapinoe from the roster.

    • guest

      i’m kind of disappointed myself. i was hoping to see megan rapinoe’s new us president trump protest at the sbc games.

      • guest

        no need to worry. rumor is that megan rapinoe will be doing the half-time show at the sbc games.

        • rkmid71

          Really? That would be cool. Maybe she could become a freestyler like Indie Cowie. Btw — watching an Indie Cowie halftime show would be reason alone to go to a game.

  • #1Fan

    Slightly off topic, but on the theme of US WNT pollcy and selection. I see that the U-18 played England to day and drew 0-0. From looking at the picture of the starting line up it seems that we started 8 players in all 3 games. How is this development? How do you find out about players by NOT giving them a chance to start?

    The unwillingness or inability to give complete auditions to players at all levels of the NT ladders is baffling and stupid.

    • Guest

      That is so true. Same kids that failed go on yet another trip using up yet more resources. Brilliant or according to Einstein – insane as his definition of insanity was doing the same thing over again and expecting a different result…

      There have to be more kids out there worthy of some resources and real chance to prove themselves.

      I will repost the examples someone put forward before. Does anyone else have any? I will look to see if I can find some more when I get a chance

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jrh52D24Q-8

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s_obXaf_NGE

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n7utYc9QM4g

      I know of another one similar. Known by the USSF. Invited to a token camp or two but largely discounted. This is an older video, but seems to be the only one specific to her. One of the fathers on this storied team, Deanna force published a bunch of great videos from their u14 year showing the terrific soccer this team played. I watch this club carefully because of their sophisticated style of play. This kids dad coaches that storied 98 team that is about to age out of youth soccer.

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-IfCLXIoaDg

      First kid doesn’t have a commitment listed. Second Duke and third Cal

      • Guest

        Sorry autocorrect
        Deanza Force. Is the club

      • #1Fan

        I don think its about whether they failed or succeeded as such. I believe NO MATTER WHAT, we should be seeing as many kids as we can early in the cycle. If a kid succeeded, great- file it away and keep tabs on her at Club level thru watching an dialogue with her coaches. Give her goals/things to work on and get her back in in a few camps.

        If a kid failed, try and figure out why and do the same thing. If she re-inforces the good stuff you brought her in for in the first place, bring her back for another look.

        I dont think this is how its done.

        Here is a small example. of the strikers who ended the U-16 cycle only 1 was invited to the Strikers camp hosted by Heinrichs. The others were sent to the U16 camp that ran concurrently. One can only conclude that someone in the USSF hierarchy did not think they were good enough or are not striker material. All the strikers from the U-16 cycle bar one were invited to England on the U-18 trip plus a few of the U17 WC fwds. PT for the ex U-16 crew was 90/240 61/240 19/240 . One player had 2 DNPs.

        Why take them? Why not open it up to someone else? It clear that you dont have faith in them as fwds or you would have invited them to

        http://www.ussoccer.com/stories/2016/12/07/20/13/161207-us-soccer-to-hold-first-ever-strikers-and-goalkeepers-camp-to-finish-2016

        There appears to be very little logic in these decisions. I was told on good authority that the reason Rachel Jones was not taken to Jordan was that she has failed to score in competitive games for some time. Worth noting that in 3 games in the UK 190/240 minutes she failed to score. Results were 3-1 5-0 0-0 .

        Sounds to me like we should be trying other kids in attacking roles. Doubt it happens.

        BTW is it not fascinating that your new #6 was invited and listed as an attacker ( ie attacking mid)

        • guest

          I was looking at the rosters after your interesting facts.
          There are 7 kids who are listed as forwards I think on the original roster. I know they move kids around and these aren’t always accurate. Do you know if they count an attacking mid or withdrawn forward playing as a #10 as a forward? What formation are they playing looks like 4 forwards are on the field at all times unless one is a 10?

          Looks like the big minutes were given to Spaanstra (u17 WC starter) Smith (u17 WC super sub) Jones (last cut from the u17 wc roster but fixture in the u17 cycle) and Yates and Vatne from the 16 regulars. Is one of them a #10?

          Wingate and Serepca did not play much. Travethick looks like a hybrid forward and Attacking midfielder and didn’t play a lot.

          Looks like d-mids and Box to Box mids were shuffled around a good bit. Of course I think Howell is a 2000 and would have been there of course but for her amazing performance in Jordan (I am seriously nauseated) she is elevated to the u20s. So they are looking for a dmid on the 18s. Vergura, Viggiano, Dyke and Nighswonger listed with reasonable minutes. Travithick in for Dyke on a cycle guessing as an 8.

          In the back all but Hiatt got decent minutes

          Why take 5 kids to England and not give them a real chance? Maybe they have been given chances before, but then take some new kids along instead if they have deficiencies to correct (like all kids do anyway). I mean can you even get a real evaluation of a kid’s performance when you just throw them in for a few minutes a game or two and compare against kids who have been given a stamp of approval and get to feel more comfortable? I don’t think its apples to apples.

          I really don’t understand why they keep spending money to see the same kids over and over again and sprinkle in a new kid for a few minutes and if they don’t score they are out. What are they thinking/ This age a lot is happening with development would hope they bring in 45 kids to the next 3 camps. Pick the 8 or so from this event each time against which to measure the newbies. JMHO

          • #1Fan

            Hiatt was in injury call up from ……yes Colorado. Not sure what AH plays but I’m guessing 433 or variant. I don’t pay too much attention to the designations – fwd, mid etc.

            Vatne does not play fwd for Hawks and I doubt she played it in England. Prob a mid role. Hard worker with a great attitude.

            The forward positions are interesting. With Smith going to the 20s I wonder about a few things

            Spaanstra must be feeling she has slipped. At one time she was up there with the elites in the class. Where are they going to get goals and penetration from ? None of the kids they took offer that from the forward position. This group also has no speed at outside back.

            As far as giving kids a chance to succeed OR fail, that is clearly not the USSF way

          • guest

            It seems that the 18s don’t really have a playmaker/ Only 2 goals i think have assists listed the others seemed to be individual efforts. the only spark i saw in the write ups was that Spaanstra apparently played an unselfish and heads up dummy from Smith to Dyke for the tap in. Wonder what happens when Yates and Smith encounter a defense that matches them? Oh, I guess i don’t have to wonder because we saw the same in Jordan from the other forwards… Not much.

            Seems like a one dimensional attack though I admit I am only working from the write ups never having seen them play except Smith as a super sub. Do you have further insights as to style of play? Am I off base?

          • #1Fan

            There are 2 types of play making – for yourself and for others. I think i have already made it clear that I believe the US women seem to produce far more of the former than the latter. Ive already made it clear why I think that is

            When you can be successful WITHOUT trusting or relying on others, they why bother. Almost all the kid s selected are picked for their individual play. There is no suggestion that they are looking to make the sum of the parts any greater.

            Look at the attacking players who are currently touted, they are mostly dribblers. In fact most are actually HEAD DOWN dribblers which is the worst kind.

            I am operating from a little more information that you, BUT here is my conclusion on the Eng games

            we scored 3 goals vs England in the first 33 mins and LOST the next 137 minutes 0-1. it sounds to me like we caught them cold with our athleticism ( from 1 player mainly) and once they adjusted ….what happened ?

            And what was the net result? we gave Smith a battle field promotion to the U-20 team.

            I am really interested to see who is invited to the next camp in April .

          • guest

            Good luck to yours

          • Grace

            This is the first time this group has been together. The core from the U16s under Jaime Frias played some uncharacteristically beautiful soccer with an active midfield combining in the attack. They generally out-possessed their opponents. This from some video that was floating around from the group’s Italy and Netherlands trips. We all know what the U17s played, and I would expect April to more toward that model than Jaime’s.

      • #1Fan

        I think Sophie Jones is a 2019. she is well regarded and I think she will get another chance.

        Deza has always been well regarded. No idea why she has not been more involved with the YBNTs

    • CED

      We don’t know for sure but hopefully it’s the same 8 b/c they have trained better than other players. This isn’t a house league where everybody need to play.. It should be run by who trains best, fits what the coaches want in style, technical ability, etc..

      • #1Fan

        We disagree on the purpose of Youth teams, especially early in cycles Not worth arguing over.

  • guest

    how many times do rick and reality have to say the same freaking things? they are worse than that steglitz idiot

    • sam

      I prefer Rick at Breitbart.

      • guest

        do you think christen press reads breitbart?

        • guest123

          Oh yeah she’s all over Breitbart and Infowars

    • Steglitz49

      Thank you for your endorsement.

      Btw Jessica Diggins and Sadie Bjornsen took the Bronze in the ski World Championships today — and Zlatan is King!

  • Guest

    Forecast not looking too good Wednesday, still a little early though.

    How would the tournament work if they couldn’t play those games?

    • guest

      thunderstorms… yikes. will fans get a refund?

      • guest

        geez i figured snow would be an issue. instead it’s a… thunderstorm on march 1st. even the USSF brain trust probably couldn’t have predicted that. At least climate change is just a chinese hoax though.

        • mockmook

          So, the next time there is a cold spell, you will agree the climate change is a hoax, right?

          • guest

            It’s about overall weather changes over time, not day to day fluctuations. Just because temperatures are rising on average doesn’t mean there won’t be cold spells. Read something other than Fox News… like sources from actual scientists without a political agenda.

          • ABCDE

            That’s why they changed the name from “global warming” to “climate change” … so people who can’t be bothered doing their own research wouldn’t see the headline and immediately say “BUT IT’S COLD TODAY”

          • mockmook

            Then why, genius, were you pointing out the recent weather?

            How about you get your talking points straight before chiding me?

            BTW, why don’t aren’t these Global Climate Change conferences done by video conference instead of flying in people in massively polluting planes? It’s almost as if the attendees don’t believe their own BS.

          • htm222

            Recent warm weather is an outlier. Cold weather would not be an outlier.

          • smallchief

            Rigthto, Mockmock! I’m sure you agree that the earth is 6,000 years old and the center of the universe. Don’t you?
            .

          • mockmook

            No, I agree that profound claims require profound proof. That real scientists have a healthy scepticism. That models aren’t data, so a model is proof of nothing.

            Belief in AGW has become a religion. The “solutions” all involve impoverishing the planet while not guaranteeing to fix the problem. The “solutions” all involve concentrating political power in bureaucrats who will be unaccountable and uncontrollable.

          • guest

            better to let mega corporations do what they want. they sure have a history of protecting the planet and consumers. the profit motive doesn’t have any perverse consequences. i mean, who the hell needs regulations or international cooperation at all? #MAGA

          • mockmook

            The biggest and most powerful “mega corporations” are governments. The worst abuse of the environment (and people) has been by communist governments (like China).

          • guest

            where did i advocate for communism? Trump supporters are excellent at strawman arguments.

          • ABCDE

            Trump supporters think that a functioning government and regulations designed to protect the economy, consumers and the planet = communism. 30B for a useless wall and increasing millitary and police spending is totally cool though.

          • guest

            I figure this attitude will start dying off with the Cold War era boomers. Millennials skew liberal.

          • mockmook

            I didn’t say that — projection?

          • guest

            People like you scare me so much more than any Syrian refugee.

      • CED

        The thunderstorms risk is high in the morning 80+% and decreases substantially as the day progresses according to current forecasts.

  • guest123

    JM Aulas at it again. At this rate, he’s going at all of the USWNT.

    https://twitter.com/JM_Aulas/status/836244310211366912

    • Steglitz49

      American players are good, so why not acquire a couple more while you are at it? Cheaper by the dozen?

      • guest123

        So how much do you think Allie Long is worth? Lyon’s current top 3 earners are (without any performance bonuses):

        Alex Morgan: 30K €/month
        Wendie Renard: 15K €/month
        Dzsenifer Marozsán: 12K €/month

        http://www.sportune.fr/sport-business/ol-elles-gagnent-combien-les-feminines-de-lol-153525

        • Reality

          Given Morgan’s rate of pay of 30K €/month starting on 1/6/17 when she signed her contract and with the next game for Lyon not until 3/12/17 (a total of 64 days), she has a total of about 4.5 hours of actual game play so far which works out to about 14,222 €/hour. A pittance compared to some of the major men’s soccer stars, but respectable nonetheless.

          • Steglitz49

            Zlatan earns £260,000 per week. Alex has a bit to go yet.

        • Steglitz49

          I suspect that Allie would want 10 k€/month but would settle for 8 k€/month, maybe even 7.

        • guest

          let’s see what happens in the off-season. i’m thinking hegerberg is gonna want a big raise for being the top forward at least equal to morgan.

    • Reality

      Since Precheur is leaving after this season, maybe Aulus can solicit Ellis.

    • guest

      there is only so much room left on the lyon bench.

  • guest123
  • guest123

    Off-Topic: Toni Payne – FCKC’s # 13th pick this year heading to Ajax/Amsterdam and foregoing NWSL.

    https://www.topdrawersoccer.com/club-soccer-articles/former-duke-star-toni-payne-signs-at-ajax_aid41509

  • guest123

    Off-topic: Wake Forest’s Sarah Teegarden signing with Goteborg FC/Damallsvenskan. She went undrafted in this years’ NWSL draft. Savannah Levin (Cami Levin’s sister/Orl Pride) from USC also recently signed with Goteborg FC.

    http://www.goteborgfc.se/2017/02/27/v%C3%A4lkommen-till-kgfc,-sarah-teegarden-35468233

    • Steglitz49

      Götebrog, that great soccer academy on the west coast, where a young Hope Solo cut her teeth and where more recently Cami Levin, Yael Averbuch, Ingrid Wells and Christen Press played.

  • guest123

    Off-Topic: Germany’s Fatmira Alushi retires from soccer.
    https://twitter.com/UWCL/status/836558352159240193

  • #1Fan
    • #1Fan

      I cant think of many 16yr olds asked to play defensive mid on any international team of note. Male or Female

      • DNG

        It’s not typically a position I’d be comfortable starting a 16 y/o in. I’m kind of worried about how she will fare if given significant time.

      • DNG

        I agree with your line of think that now that she has been selected she will get time. wonder if Ellis thinks this is the exact same thing as starting Pugh on the wing. Playing DM or CM is very different from playing a speedster on the wings.

        • #1Fan

          Agree wholeheartedly. Im surprised that C Murray equates the 2. Could not be more different. CM in most teams is the platform from which you bnuild. Ir requires a lot of intangibles and experience to do it well. Its amazing that

          1. Ellis thinks its viable to put a player there who has very limited experience in that role

          2. Seems to have no other options he believes in

          If she does well there, then it says a lot about the womens game.

          Any team would target her defensively with aerial balls and movement in and around her to see who she picks up and how she responds positionally. its fine when we have the ball, but iI am concerned about what happens when we dont.

          • DNG

            1. I question a lot of Ellis’ judgment so this is just another added to a long list

            2. I’m not sure I completely buy this. Ellis seems intent on making the team very young in almost a complete 180 from the veteran laden teams of the past but without eliminating the entitled club aspect. I think the CBA needs to change this and maybe Ellis is restricted by the CBA at the moment.

            “If she does well there, then it says a lot about the womens game.”

            I think it will say a lot about where the US is in terms of developing CM. I think France and Japan are way ahead in terms of developing excellent CMs. I also thought the way Allie Long was inserted into the squad last year said a lot as well(or maybe is says more about our inability to scout the position).

          • #1Fan

            Good points.

  • guest

    I really don’t see Germany’s or England’s back line being able to thwart a combination of Press, Dunn, Pugh, Lloyd, Morgan etc. Too much speed for them to deal with, and as much respect as I have for Bronze, she can’t do everything. I think England might suffer without Greenwood, who was critical to their back line last year. And France can’t score in international games. So I am comfortably betting on USA winning all their matches again.